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Post by Neil Pickup on Nov 13, 2009 11:39:51 GMT -5
I think every point made on this thread is a reality for someone who has tried to "get into" armwrestling....... I also think all of these points come down to one contributing factor- that you either have or you don't- and that's having your heart in the sport. If your heart is in it, it doesn't matter if you are in pain, if the tourney takes all day and all night, if you go to a tourney and get your as* handed to you....if you have heart, NONE of it is relevant. Your passion will pull you through all of the things that make others quit...and you will become one of the small numbers in the world that will always be a part of the sport, even if your name is never recognized among others- you will be there because you love it.......... Excellent insight Janie, for me your comments here are right on the money ALL combat sports are a mirror of one another no excuses means that in combat sports its harder to be on the fence your or either in or your out. Reality. Neil
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Post by Steve Kirlew on Nov 15, 2009 14:49:36 GMT -5
The thing that stops new guys from coming back is generally PAIN...that DEEP tooth ache pain we've all felt after training for days, sometimes weeks after!
Because most of the new guys who come into my club already workout at the gym...they don't want this pain to stop their normal training. It's hard to make the 100% leap into just armwrestling training..most guys want to continue their normal gym training...until the love for the sport grows and they start focusing that training more on AW.
Yes it may be about not having the heart/love for the sport but that heart/love doesn't come from your first training session. For a lot of people that pain is too much for them..it knocks them out of their normal training for weeks and they don't want that again.
So we need to take it easy on these new guys and build them up. We need to be willing and humble enough to loose a match against a new guy if they're going dangerous. I've seen too many times, the 'pros' or semi pros doing anything to win against a new guy and not taking any notice that the new guy is in a break arm position! This is not cool! Yes armwrestling is a pride mans sport but not when you've got a new comer who is about to injure himself and will probably never come back again because of the EXCRUCIATING pain he'll feel for days after!
Take it easy on new comers..even if they are cocky! ;D
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Post by Johnny Edwards on Nov 15, 2009 20:20:05 GMT -5
^ I agree with that Steve it keeps them interested if you tell them they feel really strong to you also.
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Post by Charles Audette on Apr 25, 2010 16:05:36 GMT -5
PAIN injuries i didn't really start until i was 34. i am in tons of pain and i feel like it takes me a lot longer to recover than when i was younger. love it though. you have to enjoy pain to A.W. lots of little nagging ijuries when you first start(if you start when your not 18)
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Post by David Owens on Apr 25, 2010 20:23:57 GMT -5
"6) Lack of a Local Presence " I think if we can change this we will see the big boom we all crave within 5 years. how to do it ......work! my self and Blake Perry are heading the TAA. a new org in Tennessee specializing in local armwrestling on the novice level. we have already had 3 events (2 this year) and each has been better than the last. we planned for six total about 1 every 2 months. entree fees are $10 each half of the money in any given class goes to the winner of that class. the other half goes into a prize fund in which we are having a points race in each weight class (6 total) at the end of the year the winner of each class is going to get a new armwrestling table (supplying tables to pullers and giving them something to work for at the same time) The events are no more than 1 and a half hour drive from each other at the most, some just 5 minutes up the road. so its affordable its local there is incintive and two places to train. I have to say its picking up quite well and we are bringing new pullers to the sport everyday. in 5 years who knows how many pro's TN will have (I think right now we have less than 10) don't get me wrong its work but the events can be run in a couple hours and most venues will sponsor the medals or plaques. all the money goes right back to the pullers in one way or another so for me and Blake its just love of the game oh ya and coming toon some badass TAA shirts if you like the idea and I can help with info on how we do it PM me or sign up for our forum at www.tennesseearmwrestling.comwe can make it happen people lets take action and spread like wildfire !!!!!!!!
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Post by jonathanvazquez on Apr 25, 2010 20:31:14 GMT -5
"6) Lack of a Local Presence " I think if we can change this we will see the big boom we all crave within 5 years. how to do it ......work! my self and Blake Perry are heading the TAA. a new org in Tennessee specializing in local armwrestling on the novice level. we have already had 3 events (2 this year) and each has been better than the last. we planned for six total about 1 every 2 months. entree fees are $10 each half of the money in any given class goes to the winner of that class. the other half goes into a prize fund in which we are having a points race in each weight class (6 total) at the end of the year the winner of each class is going to get a new armwrestling table (supplying tables to pullers and giving them something to work for at the same time) The events are no more than 1 and a half hour drive from each other at the most, some just 5 minutes up the road. so its affordable its local there is incintive and two places to train. I have to say its picking up quite well and we are bringing new pullers to the sport everyday. in 5 years who knows how many pro's TN will have (I think right now we have less than 10) don't get me wrong its work but the events can be run in a couple hours and most venues will sponsor the medals or plaques. all the money goes right back to the pullers in one way or another so for me and Blake its just love of the game oh ya and coming toon some badass TAA shirts if you like the idea and I can help with info on how we do it PM me or sign up for our forum at www.tennesseearmwrestling.comwe can make it happen people lets take action and spread like wildfire !!!!!!!! David that is dedication. Awesome work, keep at it.
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Post by Robbie Weast on Apr 25, 2010 22:07:25 GMT -5
Gotta go with #8 (the pain) definitely. I was unlucky enough to try and start this sport around the same time I got laid off from my career in architecture. As a result I've been dependent on my manual labor jobs (landscaping and construction) for the past 1.5 years to pay bills. After practice I'm totally worthless with a hammer or shovel and that just can't happen right now with this economy for me. For all you studs who have started this sport while working with your hands for a living...you amaze me because no amount of ibuprofin could get me through it. Hopefully in the future I can get my wimpy desk job back and then I can start the pain again
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Post by Anthony Edens on Apr 26, 2010 11:27:15 GMT -5
I have seen all of our local guys drop out for each of the reasons mentioned. Most people in my town do work a manual labor job and after one practice they were done. (pain) Another guy who has tremendous natural strength lost interest when he found out there isn't any money in it. It is a frustrating thing when you are trying to grow the sport. Here's an example if you can even wrap your mind around it. We had 2 guys win their respective weight classes back to back the first 2 years we held our local tournament. In year 3 we offered $250 overall prize and $100 for first place for each weight class. Neither of those two guys were even interested in coming to the tournament. Crazy??? The heavyweight dude would have definitely went home with $350 by attending a tournament that was 5 miles from his house? I've come to grips with the fact that armwrestling is not a spectator sport and we'll just have to be happy with the slow growth.
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Post by Bill Arnold on Apr 26, 2010 11:44:36 GMT -5
Tim, this is an excellent topic - thanks for starting it. As armwrestlers, it is in our best interest to try and build the sport.
There are so many reasons why people don't get hooked. And it may not matter whether pain, fear of losing, or some other factor contributes it. I think your most important point is really, "How do we encourage newcomers and "hook them" (no pun intended) to the point where they battle through the pain, the fear of losing, or whatever reason causes them to quit. All of us have sacrificed through the pain, the laziness, the money, the time commitments - why don't others?
I'd like to offer my story, and one suggestion to help with this topic. My first tournament in 1981 was hosted by Brian McSherry. There was no amateur in that day - just open. I walked in at 165 pounds, foolishly confident that I would win. However, I actually did win. Now, if that was the end of the story, I probably would have walked away thinking I had whipped the sport and maybe never done it again. I didn't realize that there was a State tournament the week before, and all the normal pros didn't show up to pull in my class. So I had really beaten just normal guys like myself. After the tournament, a 135 pound guy named Rick Delaney, multi time state champion, asked me to pull. He quickly showed me that I wasn't quite as tough as I thought. Kicked my butt all over the place. But here's the important part for me...he invited me to come and practice with some of the local pros - Harley Maynard, the McSherry's, Bill Bellew. They explained the pain aspect, the commitment, the training, the technique. They introduced me in the right way, and I was then hooked.
So Tim, here's something that we could all do... especially those putting on tournaments... make announcements and recognize the first timers. Work to get them hooked up with local pros so they can attend real practices with people who will care about their growth and educate them. Mentoring is a very powerful tool, and feeling like you are part of a group is just as strong. We can accomplish this with some discussions at each tournament, devoting 5 minutes to recognize the newcomers. In fact, when I go to tournaments from now on, I will ask the director to announce for anyone geographically close to me, to come and attend our practices. If we all help make ourselves more available to take a few extra under our wings, it will help.
Good job Tim - thoughts like yours will really help.
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Post by Corey "FLASH" Miller on Apr 26, 2010 11:51:53 GMT -5
Be careful what you wish for...more people means longer tournaments. Right now the average is 5-7 hours long? Add more people and you will have to have "weekend tournaments" just to get it done. The usual "one day" event, won't be enough time. I wouldn't mind that but the new people in the sport wouldn't do it. I'm sorry but i don't agree with this at all, this factor is solely based on organization of the event. problems why not starting on time running one table reffing - i say this because if u ever been to worlds the reffing is fast and efficient plus they are very good. good refs can speed up tourneys easily brackets - we should be running computerized bracketing. it very simple program, some even tells who is up you click the winner and it continues. way faster than hand brackets. jmo
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Post by Corey "FLASH" Miller on Apr 26, 2010 11:54:39 GMT -5
I think the initial ego bruising is the biggest factor. also the fact that it seems like light years away to catch the guy who initially bruised the ego to begin with if you decide to train. Simon said losing an armwrestling match kinda feels like getting your a$$ kicked, I think he said it perfect for most people..........you are beating them in a physical match with all their strength and opposition and they can't do a thing about getting pinned, it is humbling and for some also humiliating for newcomers to bring all their friends to an event at something they thought they were good at and get slammed in front of an audience. This is why I think most shy away, think about it alot start out very interested then fade ...why ? because in a very short time of practice and tournaments.....they have seen and had enough to figure where they stand. plus alot of "big" buys try it out or gym rats figuring they should be real good cause they can curl a lot..............again........it is humbling. If you can check your ego you will be all good, but I think it is a huge factor. Exactly EGO #1 problem
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Post by Corey "FLASH" Miller on Apr 26, 2010 12:09:51 GMT -5
i think that the problems that lead to people not dropping out of sport are- 1. cofindence - in their self and abilities 2. lack of drive 3. ego 4. money to be able to go places- which stems from #1 because if there is prize money they think they cant win any 5. time
these are in no particular order. i have had alot of people excited to train and everything but as soon as number kicks in its pretty much down hill. i believe that most new guys get the pain in practice because they are pulling againist people to strong for them (for starting) if u practice witht he same guy and he cant move u and u feel fine after all practices and hes dieing then u need to even the playing feild not only to help ur self but to help them. thats why at my practice we use band to compensate or the better guy works out before, anything to level it out some.
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Post by Heath McDonald on Apr 26, 2010 12:55:05 GMT -5
This is is a prime example why some individuals don't give it a fair shot in the sport of armwrestling. About year ago I almost talked my cousin into go to his 1st local tournament here in Nebraska that Mary McConnaughey was puting on. He is a semi pro football player, about 30 years old. Super strong and weighs about 260lbs. A month before the he was going to enter the tournament, he got cocky and decided to armwrestle an older guy that has been in the sport for probably 30 years for a best of 5 for $100.00 bet. I refed the match. He lost every match, but not easy. Then he got pissed off and wanted to armwestle me and I beat him. My cousin is very competetive and hates to loose. He never did go to Marys tournament. Pain and loosing is definitally the biggest reasons why it is hard to bring new people into this sport.
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Post by Todd Smiley on Apr 26, 2010 15:36:22 GMT -5
The losing is easier to digest when you figure out who the guy is you lost to. If the guy you lost to is a seasoned puller it is no big deal, but if it is someone who is of similar size or smaller after you have been training and they just show up and beat you, that is harder to get over. I have been pulling off and on (when time allows) for 4 years, and have never placed higher than 3rd in a novice class (and there were usually 3-5 guys in the classes) < makes you proud of that 3rd place/last place finish, but I still go to support others.
Now onto the flip side, my brother has had a phenominal armwrestling career, started when he was 13, took one 2nd place his first year, and never lost a match after that loss in either the 13-15 or 16-18 classes. Started pulling Mens Novice at 15, and was no longer eligable to pull as a novice before he turned 16. He got his first 1st place finish in Mens open at 16, he has gained leaps and bounds every year, and DOES NOT TRAIN.
So what, Right? Well you would think a person with such talent and potential would be all about becoming a stud armwrestler. Exact opposite. He started complaining about the pain at first, and that was his good reason to quit. Then he started getting a little money here and there, so that pain was tolerable. Now the money is not worth the time off of work, the pain is not worth the poor performance at work. He does not see a gain in pulling again.
All in all, it seems that the promoters and refs make more money than the people who make the show. While I am not sure how most events are run, I do know at some events refs get to pull for a discount fee or even free, and are also paid to ref. That is fine, people have to be compensated for their time, (and hassle they deal with from competitors)
I think any event that is paying out $$$ in the Open classes are the way to go. Those guys are less concerned about a trophy and would rather have some money back in their pocket for gas, hotel, etc.. Even if payout is $50 for 1st, it helps. Trophies are awesome when you start, and unless they are for a major event, dont mean as much the further along you go.
I still enjoy pulling even though I suck, I will still go to tournies to support the local organization, even though the time and effort I can spend on my other hobby would be much more rewarding. (vintage motorcycle flattrack racing) which BTW I took home a 3rd, (2) 2nd's and my first EVER Feature win over the weekend...
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Post by Jesse Mize on Apr 26, 2010 20:26:43 GMT -5
This post is coming from a "new guy in the sport" that has watched a lot of arm tv in the last year and has a whole new respect and understanding of the sport and people who stick with it. Only competed in 3 tournaments in the last 5 years and they were all local events here in Bakersfield, CA. Last year took first in the light heavies without any training ever and heard I could watch the whole event on something called Armtv, so went home bought a month of armtv just to watch that one event. Took a week or so for Gary to edit the event, so browsed around the site and started recognizing people at other events that won here in Bakersfield. Got hooked, became and armtv junkie and realized after hours of watching other events PROS or dedicated arm wrestlers have to travel to stay competitive.
So my point is that most new arm wrestlers that go to a local event have a lack of knowledge and don't realize that a lot of the people there, might not be locals. So If your one of those guys "and I was" that says i never get beat, you might be right until you compete in a tournament that offers good prize money. You could be the best arm wrestler in your area but when Jerry Cadorrete shows up from across the nation, your never again going to be able to say something stupid like "IVE NEVER LOST" cause your going to in an embarrassing way. And if you leave that tournament never realizing who you just lost to, chances are your not entering another tournament any time soon.
I could be wrong but I believe I'm the only local that placed this year and I got handled by a 60 year old man. So my advice to any new comers that get beat, don't just give up, do a little research after the fact cause that 60 year old man that whipped your ass might turn out to be a current world champion and even a loss could be something to be proud of when you find out who the person was.
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