broke arm positions

[Andrew Bieganski]

I know its not pretty but i think its amazing how some guys pullbut who are some people that pull in the nastiest positions. Ethan, shoey, adam martin, larratt, clay rosencrans, cobra, fisher are some that come to mind. Name some more

[John Parton]

Andrew any position is a broken arm position depending on the way the force is being applied. I have had the misfortune of being involved in 2 such matches and both opponents were square with the table. Both matches I took bone to bone in the hook in which if you don't twist to the seeming bad position all of the force goes to the humerous in a lateral fashion. There are many other examples. I know that Bill Sinks and I have had constant comment over the years about our method of pulling as well.

[John Milne]

Got any vids or pics? That would make this discussion easier.

[Robert Miller]

Good question Andrew... all the guys you mentioned are very seasoned pros & are much more qualified to answer than me.
However I do know that physically our bodies adapt & the bones density increases & tendons get much thicker due to year's of pulling. The physical stress creates these changes & allows a lot of these guys to get away with these bad or arm break positions... season pros break sometimes too but very infrequently compared to the novices...
And, as John said it also depends largely on the direction of force... you may be in a good position relative to the table & yer arm but if you torque yer humerus the wrong direction it will break fairly easy... I've heard 10-15lbs.of force! I watched a guy break his own arm by leading with his shoulder instead of his hand and he seemed to be in a good position imo.
Just my .02!

[John Wilson]

Feb 27, 2013 21:50:16 GMT -5 Robert Miller said:

I watched a guy break his own arm by leading with his shoulder instead of his hand and he seemed to be in a good position imo.

That is the case 99% of the time in my experience. And the farther your elbow is from your rib cage the easier it will break.

Keeping the humerus alongside your ribs is the best way to protect it, way more important than the direction your forearm is sticking out in - I am a firm believer in this. Your elbow joint may scream bloody murder, but at least you can feel that.

[John Milne]

I've recently been working on a very new move to me in practice. Generally it goes right into the joint so I try to build it up slow and only work it 5-6 hard times per practice. The other night it bypassed my joint and went right into my upper arm. It got hot very quick and I was sure I could feel my bone twisting. I let off right away and of course the pain left.

I'm going to be careful with that move.

[Robert Miller]

Thanks for chiming in John... I always appreciate yer insight brother! This is a topic we don't always wanna discuss but has to be addressed... especially to keep the new guy's/ novices safe!

[John Milne]

I didn't always use joint pressure but found it potentially very strong and effective. I built it up slowly and carefully and I use it very often but I do now... mostly in the defensive hook.

Almost anything can lead to injury, there is an unpredictable force opposing you. Actually it's usually a combination of forces coming at you, this is the nature of our sport. I think that sometimes a position can look bad and be fine - and the opposite can be true as well. It really depends on the puller and his angles.

Edit: The move I mentioned in my previous post has nothing to do with this joint pressure move I'm talking about. Hope it's not confusing.. I seem to be all over the place here

[user123]

In the match I was in when my opponent's arm broke, we were in a deep hook, closer to my side of the table. From what I remember, he attempted to hit and lead with his shoulder, which caused the break. Too much torque.

[John Milne]

too much torque... ehhhhh.. i dunno

it's more about bad positioning. just like you said, he lead with his shoulder while in the losing position. he probably tried to use more power and speed than strength too, which will increase the chances of crap going south. that causes more of a spike in pressure - which will rapidly increase the chance of damage.

lack of experience, lack of technique, not knowing what to do in a situation are all more factors than too much torque (imo). i haven't seen the match of course and i'm just guessing, but it's an educated guess.

[user123]

Well, I say too much torque because the puller was very experienced and had been successful in the sport for quite some time. Definitely wasn't a lack of technique or situational awareness.

[John Milne]

Feb 27, 2013 22:33:13 GMT -5 user123 said:

Well, I say too much torque because the puller was very experienced and had been successful in the sport for quite some time. Definitely wasn't a lack of technique or situational awareness.

ok, my bad

[user123]

Not like you could have known! Definitely not something I want to go through again. My arm was fine and it was still terrible.

[CHRISTIAN BINNIE]

Is it possible to some how put something u "click" on on the board where u put a word in and old posts pop up on the subject ur looking for?

For the millionth time, like Robert Miller said, STRESS to a bone strengthens it, SO veterans, pros, what have u, tend to be able to pull in many different, awkward positions without anything happening..
Hence the reason why breaks occur to Novices...
Again, just for the record, U break UR arm, it's UR force that does it, NOT ur opponent.
Breaks DONT JUST OCCUR IN A so called "BREAK ARM" position.

I personally have seen breaks where one was about to pin someone, were one was close to a pin and was coming back from it. AND MINE WAS DEAD CENTER OF THE TABLE...

This "click" button could also be used for words like, oh let's see, what qualifies u as- "NOVICE", "AMATEUR", or the word "steroids" or "Olympics" just to name a few...

[Joey "TANTRUM"]

"For the millionth time, like Robert Miller said, STRESS to a bone strengthens it, SO veterans, pros, what have u, tend to be able to pull in many different, awkward positions without anything happening.."

both micheal todd and rj Moliere have broke their arm within the past 5 years