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Post by simon on Jun 24, 2005 14:57:30 GMT -5
I am not advocating the use of steroids as it applies to us.
I am simply questioning the separation of the dangers associated with the intelligent use of, (not silly abuse of) steroids by healthy adult males from the fair play discussions regarding participating in international sports, and I thought this report was very interesting.
Some major points they made:
There is no long term medical study on the use of steroids, so there is no hard evidence.
The top researcher in the world on this subject can only find 12 deaths that can even possibly or remotely be related to steroid use.
The AMA and DEA were against listing steroids as a controlled substance.
When it comes to international sporting events since you cannot regulate intelligent use from silly abuse, I would agree 0 tolerance is appropriate.
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Post by josephsirois on Jun 25, 2005 2:58:11 GMT -5
Simon I saw it the other night and was quite shocked, I would have guessed that thousands and thousands of deaths had been linked to steroids.
I'm still an advocate of going el' naturale', though remember that post I had made a long time ago about genetic reconstruction? I'd still go for that, lol.
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Post by simon on Jun 27, 2005 11:14:48 GMT -5
I too was shocked, I thought for sure there would be piles of case studies and evidence to support the dangers of steroid use, particularly considering that the government continues to ban supplement after supplement with no direct evidence that those substances ever harmed or killed anyone, not to mention how vast the WADA list is for banned substances. As I have said on here before there was one independent study that showed that continued use, as directed, of over the counter diuretics has more ill effects on the human organs than as directed use of currently illegal steroids. This started out as a ban to protect people from dangerous side effects and now I am not sure what it has become, they are continually banning items that are sold for large periods of time, ones that they have no evidence to substantiate they are dangerous, or ones that are only somehow linked to a very small group of people that abuse the substance with a litany of other unhealthy habits….. they banned ephedra though it has been used for decades, why…. because some people were starving and dehydrating themselves while abusing the substance during heavy activity in 100 degree heat? More people drown in this country than all of the possible manner of deaths you can think of combined yet getting in water or having standing water is not illegal. How do we have a policy against such supplements but at the same time we have this silly homeopathic supplement act in effect? Currently as long as a supplement has the disclaimer that says that its claims of improvements have not been evaluated by the FDA and it does not claim to cure anything, you can put almost anything you want in a pill and sell it under this act. So I have to ask what exactly is natural anyway? It really depends on who you ask, just because something is legal in this country does that really put it in the category of natural, and isn’t that a silly way to deem it as such, at some point all the harmful drugs in the world were legal, and isn’t everything technically natural? As in, of nature? Not arguing just making some points about how confusing this all is. I am counting on some manner of genetically grown replacements or enhancements etc. because my body will surely be very broken down in the not too distant future.
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Post by josephsirois on Jun 28, 2005 11:59:36 GMT -5
The FDA and the FTC are crippling American's health rights. Please, anyone interested in their own health read the article I am going to provide in the link below. Simon, you're probably already aware of how F*cked up the FDA, the FTC, and the AMA are... www.lef.org/magazine/mag2001/may2001_cover_reform.html
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Post by josephsirois on Jun 28, 2005 12:02:06 GMT -5
The link I provided is really only skimming the surface of how terrible the corruption is, when I can find more/better articles, I'll post them.
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Post by simon on Jun 28, 2005 13:04:39 GMT -5
I will go read the link here in a bit but you are correct it is criminal how this is functioning.
Let me see....
Those in need of life saving drugs cannot get them as they are not approved in this country yet, though these drugs have shown significant success in other countries for decades.
Seniors and the afflicted that are in need of drugs to help them battle the effects of aging and ill health cannot afford them.
Cigarettes are legal, and so is Alcohol, no question about the ill effects of abusing these items.
According to the current US policy as long as you admit on the bottle that the FDA has not validated your claims and your claims do not include curing any illness, any company can sell any substance that is not already banned to the public without evaluation by the FDA.
The cherry on the top of this psychotic sundae is that despite the fact that people cannot get the drugs they need to live we are spending money hand over fist to ban performance enhancing drugs, having hearings about athletes using these banned substances all in the name of nothing more than fair play, I say this because there does not seem to be any real health dangers in using them, if there is, no one can substantiate it because there is no intelligent study on the subject.
Let’s see major league baseball players using steroids to enhance their performance in a game they already get paid ungodly amounts of money to play vs. AIDS and cancer victims not getting the proper medications they need to live due to excessive cost or the absence of approval from the FDA, hmm where should our focus be???
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Post by enginterzi on Jun 30, 2005 5:57:43 GMT -5
Simon,what exactly isoflavone is?it must be something about soy protein,but is it a problem with wada test?
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Post by Chris Gangi on Jun 30, 2005 7:06:57 GMT -5
i believe flavone is a prohormone?
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Post by simon on Jun 30, 2005 10:10:44 GMT -5
Did I say something about Isoflavone somewhere in here that led to this question? Man I must be getting old and my memory must be fading, regardless you may have picked the right person to ask, as I have been using Isoflavone since I broke my left arm in 2000.
Isoflavone is a natural soy protein derivative, its most commonly accepted use is as a supplement for women going through menopause or that have concerns with osteoporosis, I started using it after my injury due to its prowess at improving bone density and yes I do get some strange looks and questions from a few clerks at the vitamin shop when I buy it.
There are very few and maybe really only one study that details the muscle building abilities of some manipulations of Isoflavone, such as methoxyisoflavone 5-methyl-7-methoxyisoflavone, ipriflavone and 7-isopropoxyisoflavone, they are very old studies and as you can tell by the fact that you do not see many of these substances being sold the study is probably erroneous and these manipulations have no real anabolic effects at all, but to see if the compound or any manipulation of it is WADA banned I will have to do some research, I guess due to my own experience with the substance and the lack of data to support any claims of strength building value I had completely overlooked reviewing this item for a WADA conflict.
That would really suck to test dirty for trying to protect yourself from a bone injury.
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Post by Paul Maiden on Jun 30, 2005 11:45:51 GMT -5
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Post by enginterzi on Jun 30, 2005 11:46:50 GMT -5
but if its not such as methoxyisoflavone 5-methyl-7-methoxyisoflavone, ipriflavone and 7-isopropoxyisoflavone, and just a isoflavone which is in a aminoacid form,then?when i was in bulgaria i bought weider amino acid tablets.because we dont really have it in my country.after weigh in i started using as directed.later i saw this in writing"rich in isoflavone and glutamine".i know what glutamine is but didnt know about isoflavone.then i checked from google and i saw that its soy protein.i checked all banned substances but didnt see the name.thanks for helping.
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Post by Paul Maiden on Jun 30, 2005 11:54:45 GMT -5
www.bodybuilding.com is a good site to order from i have used it many times due to the rip off prices of the UK. for european orders they come from frankfurt germany fast and easy to deal with as they accept pay pal,they give full info on all supplements
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Post by enginterzi on Jun 30, 2005 11:59:05 GMT -5
thanks Mighty!
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Post by Paul Maiden on Jun 30, 2005 12:01:38 GMT -5
No problem buddy just make sure you go into cyber store.
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Post by enginterzi on Jun 30, 2005 12:04:43 GMT -5
in fact i didnt really find the answer that i needed.they are trying to sell that stuff and say good things about it.i just checked WADA web site and couldnt find anything about isoflavone being a banned substance.in a few days we get the results of doping test and im just making sure that i didnt make any mistake.
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