|
Post by John Milne on May 9, 2011 0:21:36 GMT -5
I think you've painted him into a corner Charlie. Well played. I saw that one coming from this far away.
Johnny, don't be offended, I'm not taking sides. I really enjoy a good argument/discussion.
|
|
|
Post by Johnny Edwards on May 9, 2011 0:30:11 GMT -5
True, but everyone has broken some of the Geneva codes. Let's say that this is correct. Does that make it right for another country to also break the "codes" only because other countries haven't been living up to their commitments? Is there really exceptions to when we should pay regard to human rights, Johnny? Human. Rights. Do you see any differences to the camps in North Korea and Guantanamo? I don't. At least not any big ones, except that people aren't getting slaughtered at Guantanamo. But that would be the difference... Human rights are human rights, and if you have commited to follow them you should follow them, and if you don't do it I think the international community should react, just like "we", the "good side", are reacting to different injustices in the world. Ah but here is the question, what Geneva code did the USA break by killing Osama??? They took the required action that they thought was neccesary. Sorry for the late reply
|
|
|
Post by Johnny Edwards on May 9, 2011 0:32:09 GMT -5
You state this is murder. He was killed in a raid. You can't always just take the enemy at will. He wasn't armed but they couldn't be sure of that. Your opinion doesn't dictate what you would do in the same exact situation without you being in that situation. Also supposedly he was said to have been buried according to his beliefs.
|
|
|
Post by Johnny Edwards on May 9, 2011 0:33:06 GMT -5
I think you've painted him into a corner Charlie. Well played. I saw that one coming from this far away. Johnny, don't be offended, I'm not taking sides. I really enjoy a good argument/discussion. What corner did he paint me into?? The one where it goes right back to how he stated whats right and wrong is an opinion??? Now we have these guidelines you posted so which ones say that killing Osama was the wrong thing to do?
|
|
|
Post by Johnny Edwards on May 9, 2011 0:34:45 GMT -5
Your whole argument was based on this is murder. That killing him was being the same as him. But based on your logic this is just your opinion and not a true belief because everyone may have a differing opinion ![:)](//storage.proboards.com/forum/images/smiley/smiley.png) and in essence good/evil right/wrong is just someones personal opinion........
|
|
|
Post by Johnny Edwards on May 9, 2011 0:40:06 GMT -5
So with that logic being in mind, a pedophile can in theory be ok with molesting kids because he doesn't think there is anything wrong with it, if someone kills him for the way he believes this makes them just as bad as him because they are killing him for his personal beliefs. I think that logic is flawed
|
|
|
Post by Charlie Minell on May 9, 2011 0:40:42 GMT -5
Let's say that this is correct. Does that make it right for another country to also break the "codes" only because other countries haven't been living up to their commitments? Is there really exceptions to when we should pay regard to human rights, Johnny? Human. Rights. Do you see any differences to the camps in North Korea and Guantanamo? I don't. At least not any big ones, except that people aren't getting slaughtered at Guantanamo. But that would be the difference... Human rights are human rights, and if you have commited to follow them you should follow them, and if you don't do it I think the international community should react, just like "we", the "good side", are reacting to different injustices in the world. Ah but here is the question, what Geneva code did the USA break by killing Osama??? They took the required action that they thought was neccesary. Sorry for the late reply I don't know much about those codes. All I know is that they didn't care about his human rights. The official explanation is just as you say - it was "required" to shoot him in the head... and then when he was lying down at the floor bleeding from his head it was "required" to shoot him once more to make sure he didn't blow the whole place up. And the world swallowed it all... at least that was the hope.
|
|
|
Post by Charlie Minell on May 9, 2011 0:44:56 GMT -5
You state this is murder. He was killed in a raid. You can't always just take the enemy at will. He wasn't armed but they couldn't be sure of that. Your opinion doesn't dictate what you would do in the same exact situation without you being in that situation. Also supposedly he was said to have been buried according to his beliefs. It's not about my opinion. It's about common sense. Could Navy Seals handle that old guy or not, if they really wanted to? Was the second shot necessary?
|
|
|
Post by Charlie Minell on May 9, 2011 0:46:53 GMT -5
Your whole argument was based on this is murder. That killing him was being the same as him. But based on your logic this is just your opinion and not a true belief because everyone may have a differing opinion ![:)](//storage.proboards.com/forum/images/smiley/smiley.png) and in essence good/evil right/wrong is just someones personal opinion........ It's also about following rules you have commited to follow.
|
|
|
Post by Johnny Edwards on May 9, 2011 0:47:58 GMT -5
Could you take a chance of letting all the SEALs in there with you die because you failed to take that second shot and he hit a button that blows you all up?? See now your inserting your opinion on what you think was right and wrong which by your logic doesn't make it right or wrong. Common sense tell me that a man who is sending people to kill themselves to take out innocent people is crazy enough to hit a button and kill me and my SEAL team so I have to make sure he is dead. That is common sense
|
|
|
Post by Johnny Edwards on May 9, 2011 0:48:58 GMT -5
Your whole argument was based on this is murder. That killing him was being the same as him. But based on your logic this is just your opinion and not a true belief because everyone may have a differing opinion ![:)](//storage.proboards.com/forum/images/smiley/smiley.png) and in essence good/evil right/wrong is just someones personal opinion........ It's also about following rules you have commited to follow. And what rules would that be?? The Geneva ones yet I haven't seen any yet that were broken given the situation with common sense ruling your judgement as you say.
|
|
|
Post by Johnny Edwards on May 9, 2011 0:51:20 GMT -5
"However, the Parties to the conflict may take such measures of control and security in regard to protected persons as may be necessary as a result of the war."
|
|
|
Post by Charlie Minell on May 9, 2011 0:53:21 GMT -5
So with that logic being in mind, a pedophile can in theory be ok with molesting kids because he doesn't think there is anything wrong with it, if someone kills him for the way he believes this makes them just as bad as him because they are killing him for his personal beliefs. I think that logic is flawed I don't see the connection to this logic you are talking about here and what I have written earlier. It can be a language barrier. What do you mean?
|
|
|
Post by Charlie Minell on May 9, 2011 0:54:40 GMT -5
Could you take a chance of letting all the SEALs in there with you die because you failed to take that second shot and he hit a button that blows you all up?? See now your inserting your opinion on what you think was right and wrong which by your logic doesn't make it right or wrong. Common sense tell me that a man who is sending people to kill themselves to take out innocent people is crazy enough to hit a button and kill me and my SEAL team so I have to make sure he is dead. That is common sense After a shot in the eye I doubt he would reach that button...
|
|
|
Post by Charlie Minell on May 9, 2011 0:56:52 GMT -5
It's also about following rules you have commited to follow. And what rules would that be?? The Geneva ones yet I haven't seen any yet that were broken given the situation with common sense ruling your judgement as you say. Human rights.
|
|