body building venues and arm-wrestling? why?

[Jason Gulley]

First I want to say this thread is in no way targeting a specific promoter. Nor am I speaking on behalf of any one person or organization. I have, I believe, some very relevant marketing information that needs to be implemented in our thoughts and actions as promoters and pullers.

Subjectively, I can see why a promoter would want to reach out to a body building expo in hopes at locking down a venue for their tournament. I have done it. Furthermore, I want to take a second to analyze the problem with this approach. Arm-wrestlers by nature would love to get a win on a "BIG" bicep body-builder; especially pinning him in front of everyone. I sure as hell would. However, do the group of body builders care psychologically at all about our product. Body builders are by nature all about showmanship and displaying their proportions. There is nothing psychologically or anatomically synonymous here. You all have seen the skittles commercial.

Seriously, I want to keep the rhetoric or persuasion down on this subject because if we really want to grow this marketing segment must progress. First ask yourself why Google, Facebook and Amazon want to know you so well. Because demographic information just is not enough information to be competitive anymore. But with psycho-graphics: attitudes, opinions and interest entrepreneurs can laser in on the most relevant customer.

I would submit that marketing, promoting and hosting arm-wrestling events in front of a group with young rural grit(backbone, fortitude,determination, endurance) would be ideal. In other words "This damn starter in not going to kick my ass." A big group of them.

"If you do what you've always done, you'll get what you've always gotten." Tony Robbins

Not that I have all the answers with this, I just want to look at this problem intentionally for the sake of all of us.

Please join me June 11th, www.facebook.com/events/1856396294586721/

Best,
Gulley

[Mike Cocchi]

I would disagree with you on this being a "problem". At the end of the day if you want to grow something it takes money, noting more and nothing less. Even Tony Robison knows that.

This sport is a hobbie for 90% of the folks doing it(maybe even 99%) only 10% want to make a living off of it or have even come close. Not happening anytime time soon for the majority of us. Big money has come and gone over the last 20 years, but tournaments and the sport itself still exist because of promoters using any avenue they can.

At the end of the day if it's at a bar, body building Expo, fair etc.. It gives us a place to arm wrestle, so who cares. The one nice thing about a body building expo is it actually makes the sport look more legit, since their are all kinds of strength sports going on at these expos. Could be worse ... Promoters could just not do any tournaments. JMO

[Jason Simpson]

While I can see the merit in piggy-backing on bodybuilding shows, I think it hurts the sport more than it helps, because anyone into bodybuilding isn't necessarily looking for a new sport and anyone looking in from outside likely lacks knowledge and will just lump us in with bodybuilders, never letting the sport shine on it's own.

Now, I have two thoughts here, the first would be to set up at comic-cons(dressed as superheroes?) and possibly appeal to a whole new demographic.

The other though and I've been thinking it a lot more, lately, is to set armwrestling up as a martial art and create a leveling type system, where a white belt(bracer) just starting out actually stands a chance. It can be a pretty humbling journey, learning to armwrestle. Especially when you've not been in a competitive sport. It takes a long time to see real progress at the table without those benchmarks. So far, the only real benchmarks are wins. I just feel a belt ranking system gives a newbie something to build on and pits experience against experience.
Maybe it's wishful thinking, because there may not be enough in the sport to create such a system in weight classes.

[Rob Vigeant Jr.]

I think you all have very valid points .
I've always been on the side of Jason gulley for the most part as bodybuilding and its followers are a very different mindset and goal set, but I see the expos that events are held at as an asset... So it's a double edge sword of sorts.

The leveling"belt" system is great !!!
There are not enough steps in this sport... A guy just stepping out of amateurs into open can pull either another newly open guy or the brzenks of the land... That is a very very large gap and daunting.

[Derek Wirth]

Get the sport out of bars more importantly, if you want to step past the "Over the top" days and into the future of armwrestling. How can you show the world that our sport is legitimate, when you crowd into bars and have "athletes" totally sloshed while competing? This is whats keeping our beloved sport on keel with darts, pool, and maybe bowling. Any venue is better than another dive bar.

[David Owens]

Feb 23, 2016 21:26:31 GMT -5 Jason Simpson said:

While I can see the merit in piggy-backing on bodybuilding shows, I think it hurts the sport more than it helps, because anyone into bodybuilding isn't necessarily looking for a new sport and anyone looking in from outside likely lacks knowledge and will just lump us in with bodybuilders, never letting the sport shine on it's own.

Now, I have two thoughts here, the first would be to set up at comic-cons(dressed as superheroes?) and possibly appeal to a whole new demographic.

The other though and I've been thinking it a lot more, lately, is to set armwrestling up as a martial art and create a leveling type system, where a white belt(bracer) just starting out actually stands a chance. It can be a pretty humbling journey, learning to armwrestle. Especially when you've not been in a competitive sport. It takes a long time to see real progress at the table without those benchmarks. So far, the only real benchmarks are wins. I just feel a belt ranking system gives a newbie something to build on and pits experience against experience.
Maybe it's wishful thinking, because there may not be enough in the sport to create such a system in weight classes.

It's not just wishful thinking but you don't need weight classes to do it.

Here in Tennessee we have started a ladder system that allows people to pull the people closest to their level and weight is not a factor. Currently we have 26 people on the ladder each hand and the weights are very up and down throughout the list. You have 154 guys and 198 guys who are brand new finishing their matches in 3-2 wars. All matches are best of 5 so the ranking is very accurate. But the rankings are always subject to change and we have certain rules in place to keep people active and challenge matches that started at one location bi weekly are now spread out in two locations and are happening weekly. Eventually this will have eliminated having to travel to compete for the hobbie Armwrestlers.

The problems we are starting to run into is practices so big we don't have enough tables, and we had to limit the amount of matches so we still have time to practice, teach and learn.

But it's working and the new guys are hanging around because they can pull people at their specific level. Eventually I would love to have a hundred people on this list. #goals

[Jason Gulley]

Thanks for the replies and comments.

You know when I first started selling the Gulley Grip thick revolving handle, I wanted to put "Country Strong" below GG and one of my family members said, " not everyone likes country strong." I said, "I am not looking for everyone." Point is, business is not just about capital, it is about supply and demand. And demand can be engineered by the way. For example, Edward Bernay, Sigmund Freud nephew, had wealthy debutantes put on a specific green colored dresses and light-up smokes at a parade, then he invited prominent journalist to take pictures and call it "Torch of Freedom." As you could imagine the Lucky brand sky rocketed with women for obvious reasons.

Some might say, big deal he gave a bunch of women lung and throat problems. That maybe true, but that is not my point.

Point is, it's not about adopting one philosophy and letting go of another. We need whatever anybody can do. All I am saying is we can get in front of a MUCH more relevent group of people with our product, even on the local level. If "You" have an idea, try it. You don't need John B permission or any promoters permission to try anything. Just do it.

I think it is really cool all these work-out handles are being sold. Good stuff, diversity leads to innovation.

[Jason Simpson]

Feb 28, 2016 13:30:49 GMT -5 David Owens said:

Feb 23, 2016 21:26:31 GMT -5 Jason Simpson said:

While I can see the merit in piggy-backing on bodybuilding shows, I think it hurts the sport more than it helps, because anyone into bodybuilding isn't necessarily looking for a new sport and anyone looking in from outside likely lacks knowledge and will just lump us in with bodybuilders, never letting the sport shine on it's own.

Now, I have two thoughts here, the first would be to set up at comic-cons(dressed as superheroes?) and possibly appeal to a whole new demographic.

The other though and I've been thinking it a lot more, lately, is to set armwrestling up as a martial art and create a leveling type system, where a white belt(bracer) just starting out actually stands a chance. It can be a pretty humbling journey, learning to armwrestle. Especially when you've not been in a competitive sport. It takes a long time to see real progress at the table without those benchmarks. So far, the only real benchmarks are wins. I just feel a belt ranking system gives a newbie something to build on and pits experience against experience.
Maybe it's wishful thinking, because there may not be enough in the sport to create such a system in weight classes.

It's not just wishful thinking but you don't need weight classes to do it.

Here in Tennessee we have started a ladder system that allows people to pull the people closest to their level and weight is not a factor. Currently we have 26 people on the ladder each hand and the weights are very up and down throughout the list. You have 154 guys and 198 guys who are brand new finishing their matches in 3-2 wars. All matches are best of 5 so the ranking is very accurate. But the rankings are always subject to change and we have certain rules in place to keep people active and challenge matches that started at one location bi weekly are now spread out in two locations and are happening weekly. Eventually this will have eliminated having to travel to compete for the hobbie Armwrestlers.

The problems we are starting to run into is practices so big we don't have enough tables, and we had to limit the amount of matches so we still have time to practice, teach and learn.

But it's working and the new guys are hanging around because they can pull people at their specific level. Eventually I would love to have a hundred people on this list. #goals

That's awesome! Seems like it has helped with growing the sport in your area, huh? I'd love a system like that up here. I'm still looking for training partners. I think having such a system would help ensure newbies that it's not some guy just looking to show off and break arms, but a more serious, organized sport.