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Post by Bob Paradis on Jun 26, 2007 20:52:54 GMT -5
The catholic church had nothing to do with writing of the bible.The original translators worked in secret because of the catholic church.Once the they realized how popular it became and they couldn't stop they came out with there own version.Back in those days the catholic church was known to burn Christians and other things when they spoke out against some of there teachings.Thats one reason queen Mary got the name bloody mary in her day.Im sure not all catholics where that way during the dark ages but they where originally against it.I cant remember of the top of my head the names of the translators The Bible is a Catholic work, starting with Saints Peter and Paul. They are two of the earliest church fathers. It is likely that Moses wrote much of the original Hebrew material,up to Deuteronomy. Then the authors are unknown until Ezra, Nehemiah, then unknowns till Psalms. The profits are typically ascribed to the profits or their disciples. Mathew, Mark, Luke, and John, the same. The Acts was written by Saint Luke. The entire scripture was translated to Latin by Saint Jerome. He used all ancient Hebrew and Greek manuscripts. All this work was done within the first couple of hundred years after Jesus ascended into heaven. The first Protestant church was the Lutheran church. That church was started by Martin Luther...a man, in 1532. The bible had been around for around 1300 years before the 1st Protestant church even existed. The King James version that you probably have is missing like 7 books some MAN decided to take out. This is how Jesus started His church...As He was about to ascend...(Acts chapter 1 vs 8 ) But you will receive power when the Holy Spirit comes upon you, and you will be my witnesses....and to the ends of the earth. Read Mathew 16, 13-20 verse 17:Jesus said to him in reply, "Blessed are you Simon, son of Jonah. For flesh and blood has not revealed this to you, but my heavenly Father. And so I say to you, you are Peter, and upon this rock I will build my church, and the gates of the netherworld shall not prevail against it. I will give you the keys to the kingdom of heaven. Whatever you bind on earth shall be bound in heaven; and whatever you loose on earth shall be loosed in heaven." Peter, the first Pope, was given primacy over the other apostles and disciples. Martin Luther threw away 1500 years of guidance by the Holy Spirit. The compilation of the bible was a Catholic work. Protestantism did not exist until the Protestant Reformation.....circa 1532!!! Robert....ask a bunch of complicated theological questions to different Pastors of the same "denomination." Many Protestant friends readily admit to me that it will depend on the Pastor. Each Pastor acts as sort of a pope for his congregation. In the 25,000 - 35,000 Protestant "denominations" in the US alone, times the number of congregations in each....wow, who's the authority? As a Catholic, I can go directly to a Bishop, the Vatican resources, any Priest in any city of the world and get the same answer. The only exception would be the rouge Priests or Bishops who usually repent, but sadly, sometimes get excommunicated. Not all the teachings of the church are readily understood. But, as you live a humble, prayerful life, the understanding comes. Here's a good example. 1967, Pope Paul the 6th wrote a papal encyclical, Humanae Vitae. With the culture of death growing, and people starting to use chemical contraceptives(fertilized eggs cannot implant in the uterus, so they just get flushed)he warned Catholics that in 30 years, just as many Catholic marriages would end in divorce as non Catholic. He was right. There is only one bright spot. Devout Catholic couples that obey all the teachings of the church, have a success rate of over 97%. Not bad, huh? And that sexual discipline thing...Natural Family Planning...is really tough at first. Approach it like you do the bible. Pray before you greet your spouse. Ask God for a pure love of your spouse. Your love for each other will grow beyond your wildest imaginations. And here's the part I like. Your sexual relations will be the true gift from God it was meant to be. DISCLAIMER: This is written for those who love scripture, not for those who get emotional and bent out of shape about teachings that conflict with what they want to believe. If anyone wants to know what the Catholic Church teaches: Catechism of the Catholic Church is available in every country and in every language of the world. |
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Post by Johnny Edwards on Jun 27, 2007 0:03:17 GMT -5
Although I know I don't an won't agree with a lot the Catholics believe I am always interested in learning something new that I might adapt to. God made me that way though  . But I don't see why anyone should get all bent out of shape over something like that because as long as your worshipping the Lord Jesus christ then it's a good thing. Oh an Bob I don't agree with Euthanasia either. At all. I see pain as something that should try to be conquered an my uncle has MS, Fibromialsia or however you spell it an a few other things that make him hurt terribly an he is one outgoing 50 year old man. Tough as nails in my opinion to deal with the pain the way he does you can't even tell he hurts. Most just don't have the will power an want to give up. I will tell everyone to pray for him though cause he is a self proclaimed Atheist..... He is actually my great uncle he is my paw paws brother. Ya'll know my great Grandmother is still alive that is actually who I live with currently. 76 going on 77. |
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Post by Ryan Thames on Jun 27, 2007 2:42:39 GMT -5
I remember studying the origin of scripture in bible college....pretty interesting stuff.
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Post by Ryan Thames on Jun 27, 2007 2:52:22 GMT -5
peter and paul....did NOT found the "catholic" church as we know it.......they were simply apostles...and disciples of Christ. When christ said "upon this rock" he wasnt refering to Peter. he was refering to peters faith. in protestant churchs the authority is Christ himself and the scripture......No "vicar" needed. Some will argue that men interpret scripture different and thats why there are so many different religions......perhaps this is true.....so what ...honestly...gives the pope that "ultimate" authority? and....i think i agree with about 97% of the rest  |
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Post by Johnny Edwards on Jun 27, 2007 11:53:11 GMT -5
Exactly what I think almost. I think it is interpreted to each person the way God wants them to interpret it. Jesus is the Leader of our Churchs no matter what denomination so who can be a higher authority than Jesus?
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Post by Robert Bishop on Jun 27, 2007 14:52:08 GMT -5
I think there will be many from many diferent religions who make it to heaven but when you add or subtract from his word then your playing with fire.That is the main problem i see with some of the teachings we talk about.If god honors his word above his own name than we need to follow his word and not the teachings of man or any church or anything that clashes with his word
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Post by Bob Paradis on Jun 27, 2007 15:18:28 GMT -5
peter and paul....did NOT found the "catholic" church as we know it.......they were simply apostles...and disciples of Christ. When Christ said "upon this rock" he wasnt refering to Peter. he was refering to peters faith. in protestant churchs the authority is Christ himself and the scripture......No "vicar" needed. Some will argue that men interpret scripture different and thats why there are so many different religions......perhaps this is true.....so what ...honestly...gives the pope that "ultimate" authority? and....i think i agree with about 97% of the rest Ryan, I'm starting to feel that you , me, Johnny, and Robert are on the same page. The only thing I would like to add regards Saint Peter. The name "Peter" means rock in the ancient Greek. Peter, the man, is the rock, not his faith. God bless, Bob |
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Post by BigDaddyJoe™ on Jun 27, 2007 18:50:49 GMT -5
Your god is better than mines.........nanananananaaaaaaaa
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Post by Bob Paradis on Jun 27, 2007 20:13:25 GMT -5
Your god is better than mines.........nanananananaaaaaaaa Listen up Joe!!! This is a reasonable discussion on what people believe. We are all talking about the same God, just different religions. If you don't knock it off, I'll have to pull you left handed while you still can't feel your fingers..lol. How's your wrist? |
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Post by BigDaddyJoe™ on Jun 27, 2007 20:25:23 GMT -5
lol, if there was a god he wouldn't have given me the feeling in themagain.......i'm on the road to a lot of anti inflamitories and pain killers........all prescripted btw for those who are trboule makers.....once i'm healed i need a lot of training
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Post by Ryan Thames on Jun 28, 2007 2:35:44 GMT -5
I gotta disagree with you on one thing bob....I agree that "peter" means rock.....but i dont agree that that was what JEsus was refering to in this passage.....now before you refute me, understand that i do see why you and other catholics may believe what you believe about this passage. but im going to explain what i see here.
Matthew 16
15. He saith unto them, But whom say ye that I am?
16. And Simon Peter answered and said, Thou art the Christ, the Son of the living God.
17. And Jesus answered and said unto him, Blessed art thou, Simon Barjona: for flesh and blood hath not revealed it unto thee, but my Father which is in heaven.
18. And I say also unto thee, That thou art Peter, and upon this rock I will build my church; and the gates of hell shall not prevail against it.
19. And I will give unto thee the keys of the kingdom of heaven: and whatsoever thou shalt bind on earth shall be bound in heaven: and whatsoever thou shalt loose on earth shall be loosed in heaven.
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Post by Ryan Thames on Jun 28, 2007 2:39:49 GMT -5
Peter, for himself and his brethren, said that they were assured of our Lord's being the promised Messiah, the Son of the living God. This showed that they believed Jesus to be more than man. Our Lord declared Peter to be blessed, as the teaching of God made him differ from his unbelievingcountrymen. Christ added that he had named him Peter, in allusion to his stability or firmness in professing the truth. The word translated "rock," is not the same word as Peter, but is of a similar meaning. Nothing can be more wrong than to suppose that Christ meant the person of Peter was the rock. Without doubt Christ himself is the Rock, the tried foundation of the church; and woe to him that attempts to lay any other! Peter's confession is this rock as to doctrine. that was a commentary i qouted.....i couldnt have said it better. Is christ not the rock? or is peter the rock? Is it not logical that christ wouldnt put the foundation of his church on MAN, rather than on faith and doctrinal teaching? Not just any faith though... but faith that stands out and against that which is popularly accepted by the masses.....THAT is the ROCK that christ built his church on....not a man....not a man who is NOT christ....but the faith that christ acknowledged in Peter. in this passage.....the word "rock" and "peter" do not translate the same. and verse 18 states and the gates of hell shall not prevail against itAgainst IT....not "you" or "him"......IT....Faith....not peter Simple Junior high english (pat on the back ryan, thats good stuff) ;D |
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Post by Johnny Edwards on Jun 28, 2007 14:41:05 GMT -5
I agree with you Ryan.
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Post by Bob Paradis on Jun 28, 2007 15:13:56 GMT -5
Peter, for himself and his brethren, said that they were assured of our Lord's being the promised Messiah, the Son of the living God. This showed that they believed Jesus to be more than man. Our Lord declared Peter to be blessed, as the teaching of God made him differ from his unbelievingcountrymen. Christ added that he had named him Peter, in allusion to his stability or firmness in professing the truth. The word translated "rock," is not the same word as Peter, but is of a similar meaning. Nothing can be more wrong than to suppose that Christ meant the person of Peter was the rock. Without doubt Christ himself is the Rock, the tried foundation of the church; and woe to him that attempts to lay any other! Peter's confession is this rock as to doctrine. that was a commentary i qouted.....i couldnt have said it better. Is christ not the rock? or is peter the rock? Is it not logical that christ wouldnt put the foundation of his church on MAN, rather than on faith and doctrinal teaching? Not just any faith though... but faith that stands out and against that which is popularly accepted by the masses.....THAT is the ROCK that christ built his church on....not a man....not a man who is NOT christ....but the faith that christ acknowledged in Peter. in this passage.....the word "rock" and "peter" do not translate the same. and verse 18 states and the gates of hell shall not prevail against itAgainst IT....not "you" or "him"......IT....Faith....not peter Simple Junior high english (pat on the back ryan, thats good stuff) ;D Peter is the rock, Jesus is the cornerstone, and the gates of Hell shall not prevail against it (the Church). It's elementary school English. Sorry you are having difficulty with it. |
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Post by Michael Avery on Jun 28, 2007 15:27:52 GMT -5
I dont want to step on no one's beliefs, BUT: you are your own god.
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