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Post by Mike Moeller on Mar 28, 2008 23:15:55 GMT -5
Are there any rules that say you cannot sway side to side before the actual "go"? I have been noticing this when watching some guys pull and was just curious as to the rules. I know you have to start square, but slight swaying to time the go so your hit and the direction of sway is the same for momemtum. just curious I guess.
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Post by Bob Brown on Mar 28, 2008 23:28:07 GMT -5
This is in Ref's Grip
ITEM 2 Competitors have one minute to “Grip Up”. If in that time, they have not gripped up, they will be given a “referee’s grip”. A referees’ grip consists of the following procedure;
Competitors’ hands are placed palm to palm by the referee, the thumbs are pushed down by the referee, the fingers are wrapped by the referee, first one competitor, then the other. As they are wrapped referee asks competitor if he/she wants their thumb covered or not. Thumb knuckles will be showing, forefingers level, wrists straight and arms centered. Competitors are not to move from this set up.
Examples of movement are fingers re-gripping, back pressure, bending wrists, early start or elbow lifting off the pad.
Any movement by any competitor will result in a foul being given against the one that moves.
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Post by Bob Brown on Mar 28, 2008 23:33:50 GMT -5
There is NO specific rule about movement "side to side" before the "GO"
Good Point though.........Maybe their should be.
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Post by Jeramie Towle on Mar 29, 2008 13:01:26 GMT -5
I was not aware that thre was no pressure allowed at all in a refs grip. It seems that in local tournaments refs let you get away with more than at a major event. This is just my perspective.
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Post by Leonard Harkless on Mar 29, 2008 14:31:41 GMT -5
I was not aware that thre was no pressure allowed at all in a refs grip. It seems that in local tournaments refs let you get away with more than at a major event. This is just my perspective. That is a very short sided view of your referees. They are doing you no favor by letting you get away with something locally that you cannot do in a big event. As for movement the referee should as a habit not let someone do offensive movement to time the go. Some common sense stuff shouldn't have to be written down in a rule book. ;D
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Post by Mike Moeller on Mar 29, 2008 15:28:12 GMT -5
If you watch videos of, and I am only using him as an example, but Ron Klemba. He sways side to side very subtly to time his hit with the refs "go" kind of like getting a running start in terms of armwrestling. I have yet to see a ref stop this kind of movement from any competitors although they do foul you for movement of the should, arm or hand inside. My opinion is this is movement since you cant sway without moving your shoulders even if it is side to side.
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Post by Jeramie Towle on Mar 29, 2008 16:50:55 GMT -5
Short sided? ? All I am saying is from my own expericances ref's seem to let people load with back pressure and some slight movement like Mike has mentioned. I am not trying start anything with "my ref's" Just sharing my thoughts
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Post by Leonard Harkless on Mar 29, 2008 17:15:54 GMT -5
Short sided? ? All I am saying is from my own expericances ref's seem to let people load with back pressure and some slight movement like Mike has mentioned. I am not trying start anything with "my ref's" Just sharing my thoughts I didn't mean to either but my statement is accurate. You tend to do the same thing in big tournaments that you are doing in small ones and then you get fouled out for moving. And yes in my opinion your referees should be just as strict at small events as at the big ones. JMO
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Post by chrislydman on Mar 29, 2008 17:37:21 GMT -5
I think Leonard means short-sighted, and he's correct. Refs allowing something that won't fly at a money or major tourney are selling the pullers(and themselves) short. I haven't run into this...But I have not pulled anything but Nats in awhile. Hope you're doing well, Leonard!
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Post by Leonard Harkless on Mar 29, 2008 17:48:38 GMT -5
I think Leonard means short-sighted, and he's correct. Refs allowing something that won't fly at a money or major tourney are selling the pullers(and themselves) short. I haven't run into this...But I have not pulled anything but Nats in awhile. Hope you're doing well, Leonard! Thanks Chris that is exactly what I meant. ;D I am feeling great and back to working insane hours (just the time of year) and the tournament schedule is filling up.
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Post by Dimitry Sklyarov on Mar 29, 2008 18:25:55 GMT -5
If you watch videos of, and I am only using him as an example, but Ron Klemba. He sways side to side very subtly to time his hit with the refs "go" kind of like getting a running start in terms of armwrestling. I have yet to see a ref stop this kind of movement from any competitors although they do foul you for movement of the should, arm or hand inside. My opinion is this is movement since you cant sway without moving your shoulders even if it is side to side. I have noticed that as well and always wondered why nothing is called cause it even seems like his arm moves a bit and he's cocking back for his hit
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Post by Jeramie Towle on Mar 29, 2008 18:43:36 GMT -5
Thank you for explaining your thoughts a little more. I totally agree with what you are saying Leonard.
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Post by Mike Moeller on Mar 29, 2008 19:43:04 GMT -5
I think I will start incorporating that sway in my hits too since it seems to be accepted at tourneys.
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Post by Jim Bryan on Mar 29, 2008 20:22:42 GMT -5
Some of the experienced pullers watch all the ealry matches to gauge the referee's cadence. This way, they can time their hit. That's why referees need to change up their cadence or commands to limit this type of timing. Calling false starts and changing your cadence will usually slow down the "quick starters" All the best, Jim
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Post by Mike West on Mar 30, 2008 0:04:18 GMT -5
I was not aware that thre was no pressure allowed at all in a refs grip. It seems that in local tournaments refs let you get away with more than at a major event. This is just my perspective. That is a very short sided view of your referees. They are doing you no favor by letting you get away with something locally that you cannot do in a big event. As for movement the referee should as a habit not let someone do offensive movement to time the go. Some common sense stuff shouldn't have to be written down in a rule book. ;D Leonard, I don't mean to start anything here, but isn't that what your doing when you run tourney's all year with the USAA rules (allowing elbows with no advantage), then expect pullers to go to Nationals or Worlds under different rules, and wonder why they get fouled so much?
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