Why are there no drug tested tournaments???

[Steve Bryant]

I'm a nobody in this sport and I do not take steroids. B U T...I am very pro steroids. If you want to take them than take them. It's not the steroids that is moving that weight or pinning someones arm or winning that bike race or hitting that home run. It's still that person doing that. All it's doing is allowing you to use your body to its almost full potential. I could take roids and still not hit a home run or beat Chris Chandler. If we were all made equal than maybe people would have a point but we are not. Sooo juice up people.

[Taylor Beatty]

I respect your honest reply. Thats what im looking for

[Taylor Beatty]

I have to disagree with you respectively. I believe steroids give a huge unfair advantage to law abiding athletes that are natural. I have pulled guys at before they took drugs and adter. Before i could compete with them and now its like their arm is a machine

[Steve Bryant]

Ok so that guy made some awesome gains using steroids. But you could start training like a beast and eating right and practicing more and come back and beat that guy all natural. Like I said I could take lots of roids and never beat you at armwrestling.

[Taylor Beatty]

What about Robert Drenk and Bill Collins? What do you guys think of tested events with the UAL?

[Tommy Russell]

As long as the sh*t there using isn't illegal then its not cheating. If it is illegal ( I don't know what is and what isnt) then fk yeah its cheating. I bet everyone would have a problem pulling a dude thats jacked to the moon on cocaine coming into a tournament with his nose all fked up and eyes bugged out of his head yelling at everybody and dipping to the Jon in between matches. No difference. I've accepted the fact that I'll never be the best because I worked my ass off for for 5yrs driving 5 to 6hrs to practice fkn climbing ropes, goin to the gym you name it. All that got me was mediocre at best. I didn't start out some soft ass kid either, I've always been a strong guy and worked my ass off my whole life so I don't see how it could come any quicker for anybody else then it did me. With that said, I don't really care to be the best anymore. As long as I can be competitive with the average guy out there I'm good with that. I enjoy armwrestling and I've met some cool ass people along the way, some not so cool and all in all had fun. I don't like bowling, poker, corn hole, softball or any of that sh*t so armwrestling it is.

[Taylor Beatty]

Anavar and winstrol i believe are the biggest ones. Even prohormones now. The only reason im pushing this is because the past few weeks was trying to decide if i wanted to take that step into the cheating realm of steroids. The more research i did the more obvious it was that i would not have some secret advantage. I would only be leveling the playing field. My final decision came with the realization that my liver and balls are not worth sacrificing for some trophy or a few hundred dollars. The only time i have seen it pay off was when somebody won a harley. But that doesnt happen every weekend

[Bob Brown]

The answer is money. For a WADA test it cost about $300.00 test.

So if you want, I will test all the winners at my next event. Just send me a check for $2400.00

[Bob Brown]

Also the WAF Worlds and the EAF Championships do test.

[Simon Berriochoa]

Right now the EAF and WAF events are tested and a lot of countries Nationals are dope tested, mostly those countries that are sanctioned via their sports ministry. These groups typically have the funds and the infrastructure to do this level of testing through those entities.

For the longest time doing a proper test was cost prohibitive particularly if you are trying to be WADA. In 2010 when the US hosted the Worlds I ran the dope testing for the event and I had a new WADA capable lab in the states where we were able to test for less than $100 per test. Simply running the tests we could do at any time. The issues around testing at our Nationals comes from the concerns about making sure we do it right. The WAF likes to tag off of the WADA code because it is established and it is easy to point to that code and just ride along with the changes etc. It certainly has had an effect on armwrestling as with each event athletes are being sanctioned for failing. However the infrastructure to do it right is daunting, and when I say do it right you have to consider that athletes that sign the WADA code such as Olympic athletes must provide their whereabouts at all times to WADA and subsequently they can be tested at any time. That is the WADA program not just a sample at the event. The TUE process alone is significant, much less all of the dispute process. (The WAF etc. does not have athletes signed up to random testing at anytime).

Each year for as many years as I can recall I have tried to get the USAF to adopt dope testing at the USAF Nationals, thus far they have been reluctant because of the complexity in putting together and managing a program. Admittedly there is merit to their concerns, but I push for it because the athletes continually contact me and tell me they want dope testing. In reality it is not as simple as getting an athlete to pee in a cup, testing it, and then telling the athlete they failed and they are banned.

In the US if you accuse someone of something you better be able to prove it, because Americans will take you to task and avail themselves of every possible remedy. There is nothing wrong with that but it means you have to have an air tight process to run this because in America you are guilty to the public the moment the story leaks, so just being identified as having failed a drug screen is a death sentence. Subsequently the governing entity better have its act together before it points their finger at someone.

You can have them sign waivers to consent to the testing etc. but you have to be able to show an air tight protocol was accurately followed and have a process that allows for the athlete to challenge the chain of custody and validity of the test. In the WAF version they rely a great deal on the country to manage the failed athletes, not letting them compete etc. There is no such leverage applied to random athletes at cash events, the athlete is gone with your cash and what are you going to do, not let him compete with you ever again after you publicly call him a cheater? ... Maybe go into your pocket to payout double to give the second place athlete the amount of money they should have won?

Generally I am not moralistically hung up on athletes doping, each man has to decide what he is willing to do to win, and to live the life he wants for himself etc. Realistically likely half of the table rules we have in the sport now were made because athletes were looking for and edge and for lack of a better word, cheating on the table.

Where there is a will there is a way those trying to find an edge will always stay one step ahead of those trying to stop them. So if you are going to take it on you have to be prepared.

[Taylor Beatty]

You dont have to test every athlete and it does NOT cost $300 a test. Check ur math bob. Everyone is willing to throw the negativity of dope testing but no one is willing to take action.

[Taylor Beatty]

Honestly health isnt even the issue im concerned with. Its fairness. How are us nattys supposed to continue with the sport we love when thes drug abusers are making it impossible to compete in a fair tournament. There is NO honor in winning with steroids. That is why i personally have made a final decision to stay natural

[Simon Berriochoa]

Legal vs. Illegal is not the defining statement. Steroids are legal in many countries, we cannot define it by legal or not when each country has its own rules. The US is filled with grey market steroids that you can legally buy, I tell you what in your urine those grey market pills look just like the best stuff you can get in a needle with prescription. Many people have a legal prescription for Test, cheating or not?

WADA constantly talks about unenhanced athletes, but what does that mean? At the same time they say this.... they allow Creatine which has 15 year track record of improving performance, while the list of banned substances wraps up with "and or any substance with a similar property or benefit, " paraphrasing there....

You cannot pick and choose based upon how effective someone somewhere thinks the substance is. Does it add benefit or not, if yes tell me how do we draw the line, I eat red meat, that is a benefit over those that do not. (Please don't jump on me Rob Bigwood)

There is no such thing as parity it does not exist, Oleg has a massive hand if anything his performance proved that you can have a lot of success in the sport above and beyond normal by simply stuffing a large hand into a normal hand.

It is not money at least not money for the tests themselves, if someone wants to run WADA level Anabolic and recreational drugs/narcotic panels for an event let me know I can help you process the samples for less than $100 a sample.

WADA bans Pot and a whole bunch of other substances that most of us would not view as a PE...so if WADA is the standard, anybody using those substances is cheating, or do we get to make our own personal list because we don't think it helps them perform? Where is that line drawn and by whom?

[Ruben Terrazas]

no disrespect taylor because i dont even know you but this thread does not seem to be just about steroids..it seems to me like you have something against the bishops and its none of my bussiness i just think its wrong that your sitting here trying to acuse ppl of things you have no proff off. you say your not accusing them but most of your comments are towards them. but come on man steroids or no steroids you have to work your ass off to accomplish what they have done you cant take steroids and sit on your ass and expect big things. regardless if they do or not they deserve respect they are bad dudes and actually are pretty cool people. JMO

[Kyle Fitzpatrick]

Aug 26, 2013 14:46:10 GMT -5 Simon Berriochoa said:

Legal vs. Illegal is not the defining statement. Steroids are legal in many countries, we cannot define it by legal or not when each country has its own rules. The US is filled with grey market steroids that you can legally buy, I tell you what in your urine those grey market pills look just like the best stuff you can get in a needle with prescription. Many people have a legal prescription for Test, cheating or not?

WADA constantly talks about unenhanced athletes, but what does that mean? At the same time they say this.... they allow Creatine which has 15 year track record of improving performance, while the list of banned substances wraps up with "and or any substance with a similar property or benefit, " paraphrasing there....

You cannot pick and choose based upon how effective someone somewhere thinks the substance is. Does it add benefit or not, if yes tell me how do we draw the line, I eat red meat, that is a benefit over those that do not. (Please don't jump on me Rob Bigwood)

There is no such thing as parity it does not exist, Oleg has a massive hand if anything his performance proved that you can have a lot of success in the sport above and beyond normal by simply stuffing a large hand into a normal hand.

It is not money at least not money for the tests themselves, if someone wants to run WADA level Anabolic and recreational drugs/narcotic panels for an event let me know I can help you process the samples for less than $100 a sample.

WADA bans Pot and a whole bunch of other substances that most of us would not view as a PE...so if WADA is the standard, anybody using those substances is cheating, or do we get to make our own personal list because we don't think it helps them perform? Where is that line drawn and by whom?

simon-
this is probably the best response i've read regarding the issues of performance enhancement, and the whole "natural" vs "unnatural"
skirmish. what is natural? natural is nature. is protein powder made out in nature, or is it made in a laboratory? what about all those bcaa's / peptides and glutamine? creatine? what about treating injuries with store bought creams? natural? for the most part, natural really doesn't exist anymore. we all take supplements, and supplements are not produced by mother nature. they are manufactured by scientists. and your reference to marijuana is great as well. although most do not view it as a PE, it most certainly has value in that realm as well. yet marijuana IS ACTUALLY MADE BY MOTHER NATURE. what about alcohol? any armwrestlers like to toss a few back at events? i wonder if any pullers who complain about steroids crack a few long necks at a tournament they are competing in. that is one of the best performance enhancers out there for strength sports. Also, your reference to prescription testosterone is golden. almost any male over the age of 30 can now go see a trt specialist and get prescription grade test. if they are taking it legally, is that still cheating?


...and just to put my own preference out there from a spectators standpoint, i want to see the biggest, fastest, strongest, meanest looking athletes battling it out on that table. if that means they are on the juice (or whey protein), then so be it. if you want to bring up legal vs illegal, we all break laws.