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Post by Pete & Tim on Mar 19, 2014 17:20:46 GMT -5
Tim B again Robert why don't you try that match WAF rules, wjth Rick P and Lenard H as refs. One more thing how about follow the rules that you set up before hand,unlike what you did when I pulled Mike in Tahoe,or what happened with Dave C in the crossfit event!!!!!
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Post by Robert Drenk on Mar 19, 2014 18:04:57 GMT -5
Tim, not sure what you're referring too? Are you suggesting you were cheated by UAL? I'm not a Ref nor do I call the matches. Our rules have been changed in the recent past to state that the shoulder must be above the table top when the hand in on the losing SIDE of the table. WAF states losing POSITION if I'm correct
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Post by Robert Drenk on Mar 19, 2014 18:06:04 GMT -5
Tim, not sure what you're referring too? Are you suggesting you were cheated by UAL? I'm not a Ref nor do I call the matches. Our rules have been changed in the recent past to state that the shoulder must be above the table top when the hand in on the losing SIDE of the table. WAF states losing POSITION if I'm correct
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Post by Pete & Tim on Mar 19, 2014 18:30:23 GMT -5
Tim B again No Robert the fact is you told me match was going to be run in a specific way and I planned on doing thgings in between but we know that's not the way sh1t was run.
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Post by Robert Drenk on Mar 19, 2014 19:00:34 GMT -5
Tim I don't recall what you're talking about? Bill runs the "matches" not me. I'm truly not sure what you're talking about.
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Post by Bob Brown on Mar 19, 2014 20:40:57 GMT -5
Here we go again. RULES.
I always love it when the owner of a league does not even know his own rules. So let me help.
UAL rule Competitor’s cannot drop the competing shoulder below the level of the elbow pad when in an neutral or losing position.
Notice it says "Neutral or Losing" and below "Elbow pad" NOT table top
Of course there is this at the bottom of UAL rules page.
ULTIMATE MATCH UP RULES SHALL DIFFER FROM THE NORMAL COMPETITION RULES FOR FULL DETAILS EMAIL BILL@THEUAL.COM The Ultimate Armwrestling League LLC reserves the right to make changes to any and all rules, regulations and payouts at any time.
So I guess Robert can do anything he wants. Like change rules at the last minute.
For the WAF rules 8.1.6 Competitors cannot drop the competing shoulder below the level of the elbow pad when in a neutral or losing position. This will be considered a dangerous position. The neutral position defined as the starting position down to 2/3 of the way to the losing side of the table.
Notice the rules are identically written. And after a conversation Bill, were to be identically enforced. But for some reason the rules changed on how they are enforced but the UAL did not change the way they are written.
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Post by John Schnell on Mar 19, 2014 21:40:32 GMT -5
Robert, did you forget about earlier in July???
Devon Larratt 4 Michael Todd 2
You should be proud of your stable of athletes because most of them are great, however I know just what to watch if I desire to see one or more competitors lay under a table "arm wrestling". I've seen my share of Ultimate Match Ups where both guys are checking the underside of the table for gum.
I understand what you're doing as a promoter; insert your guy into the conversation to create discussion. Good business. I also think you know spectators on the whole think that "style" used by too many of your athletes sucks ass. There are comments all over videos with the "kings move" that state the same.
My friend got blasted on social media for doing it once during GOA...the guy you're pimping does it everytime. I would say he can't win without it. And I bet that terrifies you; knowing that the general viewing public will never understand or accept that "style" of crappy arm wrestling. And the UAL has promoted it.
Dave, Devon, Tim and Richard will always be fan favorites because they pull to win. Mike literally hangs on long enough to win. He got booed at the crossfit games for gods sake because other athletes didn't understand it.
I used to love watching Mike pull, he was fast, strong, and with his (unchanged) heart pulled to win. I wish it was illegal period to have a shoulder below the elbow pad in any position.
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Post by Robert Drenk on Mar 19, 2014 22:18:50 GMT -5
Bob, Those rules apply to the tournament and not the UMU, the UMU rules are fully explained to all athletes before the event. We changed the shoulder rule after UAL 5. We (Bill & I) thought that keeping the shoulder above the table is a must when the athlete is on the 50.01 % of the losing SIDE of the table and not necessarily in a losing "position" this will help with guys turning their body's and staying out of a losing position while their hands on the losing side of the table! Were ok with the kings move so long as they can keep there hand on the 50.01% of the winning side of the table (which is extremely tough) try it As for the look of the kings move I'm personally not a fan of it but it's every bit as hard as any other move if not harder for me personally so I respect it. As for the Devon beating Michael 4-2 yes I was aware of that and it's exactly why I put since July he has been unbeaten.... After 3 years of training at Michaels level I'm sure he has gotten even better as many other athletes would if they trained like he did so if that match were to happen again I highly doubt the results would be the same.
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Post by Giles Russell on Mar 20, 2014 13:35:59 GMT -5
Robert, did you forget about earlier in July??? Devon Larratt 4 Michael Todd 2 You should be proud of your stable of athletes because most of them are great, however I know just what to watch if I desire to see one or more competitors lay under a table "arm wrestling". I've seen my share of Ultimate Match Ups where both guys are checking the underside of the table for gum. I understand what you're doing as a promoter; insert your guy into the conversation to create discussion. Good business. I also think you know spectators on the whole think that "style" used by too many of your athletes sucks ass. There are comments all over videos with the "kings move" that state the same. My friend got blasted on social media for doing it once during GOA...the guy you're pimping does it everytime. I would say he can't win without it. And I bet that terrifies you; knowing that the general viewing public will never understand or accept that "style" of crappy arm wrestling. And the UAL has promoted it. Dave, Devon, Tim and Richard will always be fan favorites because they pull to win. Mike literally hangs on long enough to win. He got booed at the crossfit games for gods sake because other athletes didn't understand it. I used to love watching Mike pull, he was fast, strong, and with his (unchanged) heart pulled to win. I wish it was illegal period to have a shoulder below the elbow pad in any position. Congrats John. This was your best post EVER. Spot on. MT can't beat any ot the elite 200+ guys without getting low. I question any promoter's judgement who would put someone out front and center as the face of their company with such horrible technical ability. Nobody wants to see that garbage. Especially if you are trying to crack into to non-awing spectator market.
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Post by Chris Gobby on Mar 20, 2014 14:08:28 GMT -5
agreed Giles. John hit that one out of the park.
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Las Botha
Silver Member
South Africa
Posts: 298
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Post by Las Botha on Mar 20, 2014 15:05:20 GMT -5
Some would disagree, Giles, Chris. There is but a handful of 200+ elite pullers that Michael cannot beat without that move. In fact, Michael Todd has demonstrated that he can beat anyone and stay "legal".
MT may choose to pull out that move as a precautionary rather than a necessity, which makes perfect sense; he has few alternatives and one might say that we should be celebrating an athlete as battle-scarred as MT who is still able to function at the highest level. That's the spirit of armwrestling- finding another way to be victorious and overcoming monumental setbacks.
It seems as though many in the AW community have just been persuaded to hop on the hate train without giving due consideration surrounding the issues of this style.
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Las Botha
Silver Member
South Africa
Posts: 298
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Post by Las Botha on Mar 20, 2014 15:23:09 GMT -5
BTW, Giles, you sure his technical ability is "horrible", or just your taste perhaps? When I started out in AW, I went around showing everyone videos to share my enthusiasm and Michael Todd's matches were always in the selection, because I wanted to show people the diversity and one extreme of the spectrum- that AW wasn't just to-the-side. And they were amazed by MT, as I was, that a man can pull that way. So from what I've seen the reaction to MT's style from this section of the "non-awing spectator market" doesn't conclude anything.
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Post by Giles Russell on Mar 20, 2014 18:20:08 GMT -5
Psssh ok. Shall I say horrible "technique" then? He is a technical puller. Like Hulk Hogan, just when u think he's done he crawls back out from under the table, to his feet, stands up and shouler presses for the win!
Question: When was the last time we saw him beat any of the top contenders (rh) by ising any kind of hand control where he forced his oppenent into a toproll or a pure hook? I can't remember.
Like the man said, poor Bart did it once on tv and it didn't fly with a single casual viewer as being legit. Go ahead and put him on tv if you want to....yawn, wtf? Now, turn the channel.
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Post by John Milne on Mar 20, 2014 19:23:04 GMT -5
Psssh ok. Shall I say horrible "technique" then? He is a technical puller. Like Hulk Hogan, just when u think he's done he crawls back out from under the table, to his feet, stands up and shouler presses for the win! Question: When was the last time we saw him beat any of the top contenders (rh) by ising any kind of hand control where he forced his oppenent into a toproll or a pure hook? I can't remember. Like the man said, poor Bart did it once on tv and it didn't fly with a single casual viewer as being legit. Go ahead and put him on tv if you want to....yawn, wtf? Now, turn the channel. Nice Hulkster reference Mr. Russell. Well done. Any post that references Hulk Hogan trumps the previous one... unless Ric Flair was mentioned but heck.. you knew that already
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Post by Derek Costa on Mar 20, 2014 23:36:57 GMT -5
Psssh ok. Shall I say horrible "technique" then? He is a technical puller. Like Hulk Hogan, just when u think he's done he crawls back out from under the table, to his feet, stands up and shouler presses for the win! Question: When was the last time we saw him beat any of the top contenders (rh) by ising any kind of hand control where he forced his oppenent into a toproll or a pure hook? I can't remember. Like the man said, poor Bart did it once on tv and it didn't fly with a single casual viewer as being legit. Go ahead and put him on tv if you want to....yawn, wtf? Now, turn the channel. Nice Hulkster reference Mr. Russell. Well done. Any post that references Hulk Hogan trumps the previous one... unless Ric Flair was mentioned but heck.. you knew that already I only read the board for life lessons now. No more living life like an a hole for me.
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