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Post by Bob Paradis on Jul 27, 2010 17:52:13 GMT -5
Oh, and Engin Terzi, I sure like having you on my side of an argument...
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Post by enginterzi on Jul 27, 2010 17:57:58 GMT -5
The penalty for sin is death..... No other religion teaches that God fully forgives and cleanses you of sin. But through the Blood of Christ alone we have been given that opportunity. . according to Christianity that may be the case but since you wrote unto all faiths then according to my belief; 4-110. And whoever does evil or acts unjustly to his soul, then asks forgiveness of GOD, he shall find GOD Forgiving, Merciful. 6- 54. And when those who believe in Our communications come to you, say: Peace be on you, your Lord has ordained mercy on Himself, (so) that if any one of you does evil in ignorance, then turns after that and acts aright, then He is Forgiving, Merciful. 5-39. But whoever repents after his iniquity and reforms (himself), then surely GOD will turn to him (mercifully); surely GOD is Forgiving, Merciful. 39-53. Say: O my servants! who have acted extravagantly against their own souls, do not despair of the mercy of GOD; surely GOD forgives the faults altogether; surely He is the Forgiving the Merciful. 20-82. And most surely I am most Forgiving to him who repents and believes and does good, then continues to follow the right direction. 3-108. These are the communications of GOD which We recite to you with truth, and GOD does not desire any injustice to the creatures. 39-7. If you are ungrateful, then surely GOD is Self-sufficient above all need of you; and He does not like ungratefulness in His servants; and if you are grateful, He likes it in you; and no bearer of burden shall bear the burden of another; then to your Lord is your return, then will He inform you of what you did; surely He is Cognizant of what is in the breasts.
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Post by Ryan Thames on Jul 27, 2010 18:30:43 GMT -5
Well I don't know how to respond to that.
I'm glad to know that me giving glory and honor to who Christ is in my life was the cause of your spiritual refreshing.
May god bless you.
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Post by ericmyler on Jul 27, 2010 19:18:11 GMT -5
Throughout history people have thought that if they could just get rid of a certain race, or people of a certain belief that the world would be better off. Hitler for example preached that the world would be better if there were no more Jews. But in the process he turned his own people into murderers.
When you set out to exterminate others who are not like you because you believe that the world would be better a better place without them, you become far worse than the people you are trying to exterminate. People don't do that because of their religion. They do it because they are evil. You shouldn't blame the Catholic Church for what Hitler did. If someone in America thought that the U.S. would be a better place without the Mexicans and started to exterminate them we shouldn't blame whatever religion they may be. We should blame them personally.
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Post by Ryan Thames on Jul 27, 2010 19:55:58 GMT -5
Hitler was a roman catholic.
Stalin, Mao and others may happened to be atheist but they did not do their deeds in name of atheism.
They were kind of religious in a sense that their belief system which was idealistic, utopian, in an odd kind of way they really believed the end justified the means and that is the wholemark of a Fanatic who will kill, murder, prison in the sake of a belief system. I dont think any atheist has ever done some thing like that for the sake of atheism.
There is a distinction between somebody doing somthg in the name of religion and somebody doing smthg who happens to have a religion.
Hitler was a roman catholic like I said and it would do unjustice to say that he did all the bad things because he was a catholic. Similarly Stalin was an atheist but he did not do the things he has done in the name of atheism.
I can tell you many examples where people were motivated by religion and did many bad things. I will challange anybody to find a single case somebody did something bad by being motivated specifically by atheism. They may happen to be atheist and as I explained above that is different.
I hope this clears what I think about the classic hitler example.Hitler may have been raised Catholic, but when he was in power, he dabbled in the occult. He was known to be a Satanist. So were his top men. As soon as Hitler publicly went against Catholic teachings, he excommunicated himself. He was as far from being a Roman Catholic as you could possibly be! When Hitler was in power, Albert Einstein began to take an interest in the Catholic Church because priests and Bishops were dying side by side with the Jews, willingly, in concentration camps. Catholics were the only people speaking out against the Nazis in Germany without fear for their lives. Einstein knew there was something there. Tragically Einstein died before he was able to convert to Catholism...very sad especially in light of some unkind observations he previously had regarding Christianity. You are right about Stalin not being an atheist though. He died shaking his fists at the heavens. He died as an enemy of God. All people, at some point or another, will get a chance to know God in a personal way. I have to wonder....when Dawkins has that epiphany, will he humble himself to the living God, or will he die like Stalin, an enemy of God, shaking his fists at the heavens. He's got a long road ahead of him. When Dawkins ends up going insane, or when he begins receiving treatment for psychosis, I wonder if his handlers will be able to keep the secret. Keep your eyes peeled. I hope it's not too late for the people that man suckered. Hitlers parents were catholic. He was baptized catholic I assume. But that doesn't make him a catholic. I have heard he was an occultist.
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Post by Andrew Fournier on Jul 27, 2010 21:39:28 GMT -5
So, I've read 90% of this thread. It feels weird being on the other side (the good side) of the conversation now. I will keep my responses brief and to the point as my goal is to not offend people anymore.
The Bible says specifically that Jesus Christ is the only way to the father. Technically, if you get down to the nitty gritty, it says "Everyone else is going to HELL". Hell was created for Lucifer and the rebel angels, not for man....but like RYAN said, because of the fall of man, we are all subject to HELL unless we ask for forgiveness of our sins through the ONE AND ONLY SON OF GOD, JESUS CHRIST.
When I read the Bible, I can tell it is the DIRECT WORD OF GOD, not the likes of clever philosophers such as Aristotle, Plato, and Descartes...
Because I am able to tell it is the direct word of God, and the undying proof that Jesus Christ EXISTED (which some atheist argue he did not (not strong argument for them), but most agree he existed and performed the miracles written (a whole bunch of miracles by the way)...as well as the most impotant fact in my opinion: JESUS CHRIST NEVER MESSED UP. HE DID NOT SIN ONCE. EVER. HE WAS SURRUONDED BY MASSES OF PEOPLE AND HIS FOLLOWERS ALL THE TIME AND HE NEVER MESSED UP ONCE. NOT EVEN WHEN HE WAS A CHILD DID HE EVER DO ANYTHING WRONG. EVER. NO ONE CAN ATTEST TO JESUS DOING SOMETHING WRONG, BAD OR SINFUL IN NATURE. HE WAS A PERFECT. ALL THE TIME...FROM DAY ONE. HE WAS WITHOUT A DOUBT, THE SON OF GOD. That is why I KNOW he is my personal savior and only through Christ can eternal life be achieved. This is of course, my choice, and I strongly recommend the same to everyone, as I feel it is in their best interest.
Is Everyone Going to Hell???..... I reserve eternal judgement strictly to the Lord. Do I think everyone else should go to Hell??? No. I do not believe ANYONE deserves to go to Hell... Everyone have a great day!!!
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Post by Ryan Thames on Jul 27, 2010 21:56:42 GMT -5
Great post Andrew
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Post by Johnny Edwards on Jul 27, 2010 22:51:52 GMT -5
Hitler was a roman catholic.
Stalin, Mao and others may happened to be atheist but they did not do their deeds in name of atheism.
They were kind of religious in a sense that their belief system which was idealistic, utopian, in an odd kind of way they really believed the end justified the means and that is the wholemark of a Fanatic who will kill, murder, prison in the sake of a belief system. I dont think any atheist has ever done some thing like that for the sake of atheism.
There is a distinction between somebody doing somthg in the name of religion and somebody doing smthg who happens to have a religion.
Hitler was a roman catholic like I said and it would do unjustice to say that he did all the bad things because he was a catholic. Similarly Stalin was an atheist but he did not do the things he has done in the name of atheism.
I can tell you many examples where people were motivated by religion and did many bad things. I will challange anybody to find a single case somebody did something bad by being motivated specifically by atheism. They may happen to be atheist and as I explained above that is different.
I hope this clears what I think about the classic hitler example.Hitler may have been raised Catholic, but when he was in power, he dabbled in the occult. He was known to be a Satanist. So were his top men. As soon as Hitler publicly went against Catholic teachings, he excommunicated himself. He was as far from being a Roman Catholic as you could possibly be! When Hitler was in power, Albert Einstein began to take an interest in the Catholic Church because priests and Bishops were dying side by side with the Jews, willingly, in concentration camps. Catholics were the only people speaking out against the Nazis in Germany without fear for their lives. Einstein knew there was something there. Tragically Einstein died before he was able to convert to Catholism...very sad especially in light of some unkind observations he previously had regarding Christianity. You are right about Stalin not being an atheist though. He died shaking his fists at the heavens. He died as an enemy of God. All people, at some point or another, will get a chance to know God in a personal way. I have to wonder....when Dawkins has that epiphany, will he humble himself to the living God, or will he die like Stalin, an enemy of God, shaking his fists at the heavens. He's got a long road ahead of him. When Dawkins ends up going insane, or when he begins receiving treatment for psychosis, I wonder if his handlers will be able to keep the secret. Keep your eyes peeled. I hope it's not too late for the people that man suckered. I am with Bob 100% Hitler was not Catholic, he was an EVIL EVIL man an he was a proclaimed satanist an spoke against Jesus Christ.
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Post by Johnny Edwards on Jul 27, 2010 22:56:25 GMT -5
An GREAT post Andrew! Are you coming to my wedding still Saturday?
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Post by Andrew Fournier on Jul 28, 2010 0:12:29 GMT -5
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Post by Andrew Fournier on Jul 28, 2010 0:34:17 GMT -5
An GREAT post Andrew! Are you coming to my wedding still Saturday? PM me the time and address Johnny!
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Post by dixonglory on Jul 28, 2010 2:07:50 GMT -5
It says in the Bible Dixon that "no man comes to the father except through me" that was what Christ said or too that effect. please tell the refferrence where in BIBLE. [YOU know i am not good in BIBLE KNOWLEDGE.]
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Post by Joey "TANTRUM" on Jul 28, 2010 7:08:29 GMT -5
Hitler was one person of many who lead in wars many wars are lead by religion many have died for their belief I heard a qoute the other day that made me laugh going to church and preaching makes you as much of a cristian and standing in a garage and making car sounds makes you a car. Weither hitler was catholic or not doesn't matter His actions weren't your action speak louder then words judging others about their religion is wroung to me in every way
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Post by Michael Wells on Jul 28, 2010 8:57:45 GMT -5
Tantrum, Punctuate! Lol
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Post by Joey "TANTRUM" on Jul 28, 2010 9:24:33 GMT -5
I do all this from my phone its very difficult and would take forever. Lol
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