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Post by Ryan Thames on Apr 28, 2006 19:04:43 GMT -5
No matter what the reason, what the cost to human beings, what the outcome, etc.? Just simply abolish abortion? i may have misunderstood you so that is why i asked if you were implying the child wasn't human I don't know how i feel about abortion in the case of saving the mothers life........thats why i wouldn't be apposed to this amendment. thats why i agree with the law the way it would be stated..... i didn't say i agree with the practice, and i didn't say i disagree with it. on this, i am neutral
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Post by Karen Bean on Apr 29, 2006 7:26:26 GMT -5
You say you don't know how you feel about "abortion in the case of saving the mothers life" so you WOULD NOT oppose if that stipulation is in the law.
So it comes down to how YOU FEEL. YOU are making a choice Ryan. And that's a good thing, that's your GOD given right! You make choices every single day of your life.
Now why would you want to take that same right away from someone else?
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Post by Ryan Thames on Apr 29, 2006 8:57:40 GMT -5
uh.....no it doesnt come down to how i feel.
if i were to make a firm stand on that loop hole thing. i would have to say that we are not god those one life over another. if it is gods will for that woman to live she will live.
if a woman is dyiong there is nothing you can do. Is it right to kill one to save another?
where did you get the idea that it was about how i feel? dont twist my words.....you seem to make a habit of that, constantly.
how i feel about the matter is irrelevant. what does gods word say?
Thou Shoult not murder
Abelincoln said "noone has the right to choose to do what is wrong"
You dont have the right to choose to murder that baby under any circumstances....
That is my final answer to that. I renig, i do not agree with that stipulation.
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Post by Karen Bean on Apr 29, 2006 11:39:53 GMT -5
You ask "where did you get the idea that it was about how i feel? dont twist my words.....you seem to make a habit of that, constantly."
TWIST YOUR WORDS? Go back and read your post Ryan. I COPIED AND PASTED IT, so what was twisted?
You said "I don't know how i feel about abortion in the case of saving the mothers life........thats why i wouldn't be apposed to this amendment."
YOU SAID "I don't know how I feel".
So, it IS a matter of how YOU feel. That is exactly what you wrote.
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Post by Chris Gangi on Apr 29, 2006 15:55:41 GMT -5
All the women i have ever talked to about the scenario of being raped and getting pregnant because of it have all said they would have an abortion for 1 reason... they could not mentally handle carrying a baby the came from pain and suffering.
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Post by Chris Gangi on Apr 29, 2006 16:03:25 GMT -5
why should you put your sisters child to death? is the child guilty of the crime? Would you rather her murder the baby of the rapist? as the broken promise thread states. a woman suffers twice in this situation. she suffers knowing that she was raped, and she suffers knowing that she murdered her own child. the question isn't what is best for our convenience the question is, what is right and wrong? is it right to murder a child because someone else raped someone? or is it right to let that child live, and see the glory of God work through the situation? I think all this comes down too is opinion...... I do love all children but science has proven that alot of serial murders and rapists have a pre-disposition to commit these crimes that stem from there family origins....with that said if a women is raped and has the baby and even if she gives the baby up for adoption or raises the child herself the chances of that child growing up to be a criminal are very high.....do we really need more of that.
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Post by Ryan Thames on Apr 29, 2006 18:21:53 GMT -5
All the women i have ever talked to about the scenario of being raped and getting pregnant because of it have all said they would have an abortion for 1 reason... they could not mentally handle carrying a baby the came from pain and suffering. have you ever spoken with a woman who has actually gone through with that? im sure i can you a few testimonies of women who killed there child for that reason that might change your mind. this is not a matter of opinion, what is murder? what is right and wrong? Do these children not have rights? Or is that a matter of opinoin? So we should kill these children because there is a high chances they are going to be a criminal? have you ever broken a law? should we kill you for it? Or even worse....should we put you to death because you have the potential of killing someone......we all have the potential to be murderers. How can we kill these babies for something they didnt do? This is unconstitutional............innocent till proven guilty....right to fair trial.......first they must have the ability to commit it.......... wouldnt it be statistically correct due to the aborttion rates in this country, that children born of such a situation are less likley to commit these crimes becuase there are more likely to be murdered by your "opinoins" ? after all they have less of a chance to exist, to even have the opportunity to commit these crimes. The bible says to train up your child in the ways that he should go and he will not depart from it..........science is stupid when they try to evaluate those types of statistics. A child born and raised by a murder and rapist, yes they are likley to have the same social behavioral problems. A child adopted and raised by god fearing people are less likley to commit these crimes science again has proven nothing......its theory with variables just like planes are safer than cars......thats crap.......i can get in a car accident and live.......my chances of survival in a plane are alot less.........the only reason it might be safer is because dont have ditches to run into and redlights run through.........if you hit a ditch driving a plane your dead....end of story......science/statistics are over rated and often worshiped as gospel truth
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Post by Harold "Rattlesnake" Ryden on Apr 29, 2006 22:27:50 GMT -5
I have to agree with Ryan here, only in a situation were the woman is in danger of her life.
I personally know a woman who aborted a baby... babies to be exact, because of the fact that she would not survive delivering them nor were the babies going to live very long either......... I agreed with her decision even with being as tough as it was. I also know of 2 different men who were the sons of a raped woman. One of those men being a God fearing Christian who always told me he didnt want to be like his earthly father because he was a rapest, but was very thankful his mother chose to have him and raise him the way she did. Maybe these are rare cases but true ones at that.
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Post by Ryan Thames on Apr 30, 2006 0:56:03 GMT -5
amen......thus proving that a man cant be guilty and put to death for a crime he never had the opportunity to commit
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Post by Karen Bean on Apr 30, 2006 20:08:18 GMT -5
Ryan you need to look up the meaning of "murder". Murder is unlawful - abortion is not. I think it's amazing that because you believe abortion isn't right you think it shouldn't be allowed. Tell me, why is your belief stronger or better or more accurate than others?
I don't believe abortion should be available at all times during a pregnancy, there has to be limitations. That should be a given. But to attempt to take away the right or need or necessity of abortion is not only beyond common sense, it's inhumane in cases. You have babies that are going to be born with horrific deformities that will cause them to NOT be able to lead a normal life. You have babies that are going to be born without brains that can NEVER even function. You have babies that are going to be born to women and men that will NOT love them and care for them. But because you believe that abortions should be abolished you are willing to turn a blind eye to these things and basically want to demand that these children are born anyway. WHY?
I grew up in the days of illegal abortions. I have seen the results of what back street butchers have done to young women. Do you have any idea how many women died? Do you have any idea how many women were mutilated? And, do you have any idea how many women will seek illegal abortions and how many butchers will surface if abortion is abolished?
Harold and Ryan both let me ask you this. Right now, today, the statistics - based upon reports from hospitals and doctors - say that 1 out of every 4 girls - GIRLS, not women - will be raped before they reach their 16th birthday. 1 in 4 under 16 years old! Now, out of that 1 in 4, let's just take a guess at how many may become pregnant.
And you guys are going to tell these CHILDREN that they must bring CHILDREN into this world? How are they going to feed them? How are they going to clothe them? How are they going to house them? How are they going to educate them? These are CHILDREN that you want to force into having CHILDREN. Why?
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Post by Ryan Thames on Apr 30, 2006 20:33:50 GMT -5
I grew up in the days of illegal abortions. I have seen the results of what back street butchers have done to young women. Do you have any idea how many women died? Do you have any idea how many women were mutilated? And, do you have any idea how many women will seek illegal abortions and how many butchers will surface if abortion is abolished? I support the death penalty for premeditated murder. If your so bent on killing that baby you got whats coming to you. You have babies that are going to be born to women and men that will NOT love them and care for them. if you honestly think this is a legit excuse to suck the brains of a child from his mothers womb and crush his skull, or stick a 9 inch needle through the babies brain. Then your sick and twisted and i cant comprehend how you think you have the common sense to operate your computer. Do you sleep at night believing that junk? excuse me while i vomit Moses, yea the burning bush guy, the one that gave us our moral laws, of which the united states laws are based upon, says that murder is sin, murder is wrong, murder is ilegal. And he said that for murder you should be punished with death. Derrick Tod Lee...... a baton rouge serial killer..... He killed several women in baton rouge. (His father was not a serial killer)........ He was determined to kill these women........should we legalize murder so he can do what he has the "god given right" to do? THERE IS NO DIFFERENCE IN SCENARIO Abe Lincoln said "noone has the right to choose to do what is wrong"
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Post by Ryan Thames on Apr 30, 2006 20:42:18 GMT -5
answer this one question.........y should these children be put to death for the sins of their mother and fathers?
this is inhumane and beyond common sense
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Post by Ryan Thames on Apr 30, 2006 21:06:59 GMT -5
CONTENT DISCLAIMER: WARNING - GRAPHIC IMAGES!! Here are some pictures of the abortion procedure taken at several different stages of a woman's pregnancy. www.abortionno.org/Resources/pictures.htmlA child's heart starts to beat only 18-21 days after conception... all vital organs are formed and being developed shortly after. That child is human as much as we are. Legal abortion has not been proven to be safe, as across the board abortion clinics have hidden many cases of malpractice, maiming and even death from mass media for fear of losing support and business. In a book entitled "Blood Money" by Carol Everett, a former abortion provider admitted to performing abortions on women who were not even pregnant... which just goes to show you how big of an industry this is. These abortion providers don't care about the safety of these women... most of them don't even read the patient their "Patient Rights" before the procedure. They are solely concerned with their financial reports. The true debate is not whether or not a child should be wanted, but whether or not a human being should have the right to outlive his first nine months of life. As an American, I support and promote our founding fathers' viewpoints that all men are created equal and deserve the right to pursue life, liberty, and happiness, especially life.
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Post by Karen Bean on Apr 30, 2006 22:49:33 GMT -5
I grew up in the days of illegal abortions. I have seen the results of what back street butchers have done to young women. Do you have any idea how many women died? Do you have any idea how many women were mutilated? And, do you have any idea how many women will seek illegal abortions and how many butchers will surface if abortion is abolished? I support the death penalty for premeditated murder. If your so bent on killing that baby you got whats coming to you. I find myself asking you yet AGAIN, what in the world are you talking about? I got whats coming to me? How do you figure I got anything? Can you read? You have babies that are going to be born to women and men that will NOT love them and care for them. if you honestly think this is a legit excuse to suck the brains of a child from his mothers womb and crush his skull, or stick a 9 inch needle through the babies brain. Then your sick and twisted and i cant comprehend how you think you have the common sense to operate your computer. Do you sleep at night believing that junk? Have you seen children abused? Do you think they were loved by their parents? Have you seen children starving? Do you think they were loved by their parents? Have you seen children locked in cages? Do you think they were loved by their parents? Have you seen children being used for sex? Do you think they were loved by their parents? Have you seen ANYTHING? Or are you so blind in your "belief" that you can't take off the blinders? You are an extremist Ryan. You go all the way as far as possible to the outer extreme to try to make your points valid. No one has mentioned sucking the brain out of a child in the womb or crushing their skull, or sticking needles through their brains. You need to learn to read better Ryan instead of going off on your tangents. I said yes, abortion definitely has to have it's limitations. That should be a given. And as far as you accusing me of being sick and twisted - grow up. Learn to read what is written and learn to discuss without trying to attack people and belittling yourself with petty name calling. This is why you have problems with people when you attempt to discuss anything whether it's religion, abortion, whatever. You fly off the handle if someone disagrees with you and all it does is make you look extremely immature and ignorant. Why about the other example you were given? Why don't you respond to them? I gave 3 examples of legitimate reasons for abortion and you only responded to 1. I'll ask you again, what about the babies that are going to be born 1. with horrific deformities that will cause them to NOT be able to lead a normal life. 2. without brains that can NEVER even function. You have babies that are going to be born to women and men that will NOT love them and care for them. Why are you willing to turn a blind eye to these things and basically want to demand that these children are born anyway. WHY? And, why not answer the other example I posed to you. 1 in 4 GIRLS will be raped before they reach their 16th birthday. If they become pregnant, how do you propose these CHILDREN are going to feed, clothe, and house their CHILDREN? How are they to do that Ryan?
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Post by Karen Bean on Apr 30, 2006 22:56:52 GMT -5
answer this one question.........y should these children be put to death for the sins of their mother and fathers? this is inhumane and beyond common sense There are NO sins of their parents in any of my points given to you Ryan. READ!!!!!!!!!!!!!! I posed to you that children should be aborted if they are to be born 1. with horrific deformities that will cause them to NOT be able to lead a normal life. 2. without brains that can NEVER even function. 3. to women and men that will NOT love them and care for them (thus starving, mentally abusing, sexually abusing them) If a child will NEVER be able to lead a normal life If a child does NOT have a brain in order to function If a child is to live a live of hell on earth Why would you demand they endure this?
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