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Post by Bob Paradis on Jul 15, 2007 23:23:07 GMT -5
This whole post is what pisses me, and I'm sure a lot of people, off about bible thumper. You took an innocent post about some study and made it religious debate. Why can't you just say, "That's interesting"? Or why not post anything at all if you have nothing constructive to say on the topic? Why must you always insert your little religious remarks? There is already quite a few topics in this off topic forum for you to spout your religious beliefs, you don't have to taint them all. I'm assuming that the original poster didn't intend to make this a hell, fire, and brimstone debate. Get over yourselfs. And for the record, just because it's "YOUR" truth, doesn't mean it's everyone else's. You're just doing a lot of yelling for nothing Chris. Matthew said he posted it top spark discussion. That's exactly what happened...most of it constructive. Did you carefully read the entire thread? Tim Leyton wrote wonderfully for your side of the discussion. He didn't go around hating scripture lovers. Take the time to read the whole thread. You might be surprised as to how constructive most of the thread is. And "truth" is what it is, not what you or I think it is. Bits of "truth" are discovered over a lifetime by people who search for it. In your teens and twenties, you can forget any notion that you know what the "truth" is. And if you can't stand religious people, you're just as bad as people who can't stand gays. Religious people are usually that way to the core. They just don't stop believing in God because you think they should, no more than a gay would become straight because a group of people told him to. And by the way...you give yourself the latitude to reject ancient wisdom, then tell religious people to "get over themselves?" I'm going to leave it at that. Take care, Bob
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Post by Justin Kaufman on Jul 15, 2007 23:48:02 GMT -5
I'm sure Chris will come back with an educated rebuttal and not to sound biased but I agree with Chris with a little less anger. It would be nice to have a constructive debate, argument or what have you with less of the "You will burn in hell" one sided debate.
Have you select few realized that once you all get going, not very many people contribute to the thread. Why? because it is never ending!!!
And nobody has answered my question, religious folks!! Will you love your gay son/daughter? or will you damn them to hell? or try to "CURE" them?
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Post by Chris Kaufman on Jul 16, 2007 0:13:12 GMT -5
The point of my post was to point out the fact that you select few have been hijacking all the threads lately. You can have a discussion without bringing God into it. I've always been told never to talk about religion or politics to people you don't know because it's almost impossible to convince someone that what they believe is wrong. I feel it works both ways with both subjects.
As far as the "get over themselves" comment, I said that because the of all the self righteousness going on which tends to alway go on when religion is involved.
And yes Bob, Mathew has been debating very well and has brought up a lot of good points, and as always so are you. I just lost my composer a bit. It's just that everyone is arguing on something that they personally would know nothing about unless they themselves are gay. It's like telling someone who is allergic to say peanut butter that they chose to be allergic to peanut butter and are going to hell because of it. It just seems kind of trivial.
I too am curious why you all haven't answered the great questions posed by Justin and Nancy about your kids being gay, and the hermaphrodite thing?
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Post by Mat Helmer on Jul 16, 2007 0:44:14 GMT -5
Matthew I have to interject that I have seen non-gay men in homosexual relationships when I worked in the State Penitentiary. On several occasions the "husband" did not consider himself to be gay. On a few occasions the "wife" did not consider himself to be gay, but the husband provided protection, snacks,cigarettes and companionship for those inmates that were never getting out. I can imagine that would be a survival instinct or dealing in the only currency they have. In prison you're either going to have to accept a homosexual lifestyle or learn to fight - real quick. I guess the third option would be murdered?
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Post by Mat Helmer on Jul 16, 2007 0:48:24 GMT -5
Apparently there are some in the Religious Community, that would like to see a definite checklist of in utero traits, so that the abomination could be corrected, prior to birth. Wouldn't that be playing God - the very thing that they are against? Discuss...
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Post by Pete & Tim on Jul 16, 2007 7:28:51 GMT -5
In prison you're either going to have to accept a homosexual lifestyle or learn to fight - real quick. I guess the third option would be murdered? This statement couldn't be any further from the truth. Why is it if you go to prison that you have to make one of these choices? Even if you are in for life, you don't have to make choices like this. If you are married, you can have visits. If you choose to not have sex with men, you would only have to fight those that choose to try to force themselves on you. You only have to kill to protect yourself and usually you are a "Lifer" and have nothing to lose, but if you only in for a stint then you do what you have to til you get out. You obviously have never been in because you would not view prison in this way. Now bring on those "Religious Folks"!!!! Chris Kaufman is my new hero!!!!!
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Post by Pete & Tim on Jul 16, 2007 7:35:49 GMT -5
... Should we hang guys like Christian Binnie and Travis Bagent? Or since your from the south, should it be Harold Owens and Cobra Rhodes and Tom Taylor? That is without a doubt a racist remark if I ever saw one and I know because I have said similar. You need to have your head examined ... Since he is from the South? Dude, I am from the South and by saying what you did you wrap all of us in your racist comment. That is discriminatory toward us "in the South" - meaning whites in the south. Do you see where you were just being racist in your comment? Do you think black people were the only ones who were hung in the South? You just admitted to saying a similar thing Ryan did, but you said it in the context in which you're accusing Ryan of. Come on man. You know I would be the first one to call Ryan out on something, but this did not have to do with race. Homosexuality? Yes. Was it wrong to say what he did? Yes. Is he wrong that he believes it? Possibly, but he is also granted his religious opinions with consent from others even though it offends more people than this opinion. Ryan is in an area where he is aware of the presence of the Klan. In recognizing it it seems as if he may share the same views of them, since he is "from the South", but I know he not capable of being racist. First off, Congrats to Allen Hester for being the first to see and point out my prejudice ways. Second, Allen you said,"Was it wrong to say what he did? Yes. Is he wrong that he believes it? Possibly, but he is also granted his religious opinions with consent from others even though it offends more people than this opinion". Are you serious? He is also granted his religious opinion? So because of his religious opinion, he can say that all gays should be hung from a tree? Are you kidding me? Your right Allen, you are from the south too, because you are just as stupid as Ryan. Hopefully the rest of the south is a lot smarter.
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Post by Pete & Tim on Jul 16, 2007 8:23:13 GMT -5
So Ryan, what are you saying with this post? Butt darts....is a choice.... God did not create them that way. If God did create people that way....it is an illness and GOd can heal them. because he clearly destroyed 2 cities because of its or 3 rather.....if u include new orleans Evolution is a load crap. Are you saying that "God" was doing a little clean up? What are you saying? Are you saying that in some way "God" can heal by ways of death and destruction? You are as dumb as I thought you were.
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Post by Ian "The Grippler" Carnegie on Jul 16, 2007 9:54:19 GMT -5
I tried to stay away from this topic but i feel I should share this story.
When i was in college a buddy of mine who seemingly had it all Girls, money, looks, even a car. WoW that's big time in college when everyones broke. anyway apparently he committed suicide due to the fact he was gay! which shocked us!
My point is in his case, if being gay was a choice he would of choseing to be straight. He hated himself so much just because of his sexual oreintation that he killed himself? that doesn't sound like a guy who wanted to be gay.
Grippler out!
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Post by JD Slough on Jul 16, 2007 12:14:32 GMT -5
Peronally I believe on the topic of Gay or not Gay. First off I don't support Gays, but I don't hate either, and there are clear statements in the Bible about the original creation of man and sexuality and how God created the first humans. I also beleive some people do choose, and maybe there are others who can't help it.
As A young christian, I have a hard time dealing with some of these things especially with the hymaphrodite or gay issues. I do believe in adaptation, and that humans are a form of animal, but they have always been the human ( homosapian?) animal nothing less. I do believe earthly things may have changed chemical balances or disease in birth that can cause imperfections in the process resulting in Gay or Hymaphrodite
Peronally i look at it like many other topics, don't treat yourself any different becuase of who or what you are and other people shouldn't either. If you are gay who cares, just don't go trying to get away with things or act special because that is what you are. Same goes with race, I don't care what race or country or culture you are from, we are all equal, so don't think you are any differen better or worse than me becuase of your ethnic or racial background.
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Post by Jim Wagner on Jul 16, 2007 12:45:01 GMT -5
<<<<<< LOOK AT MY SEXY BODY.....SEXY MAN, SEXY MAN....OH, FRISKY ARE WE???
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Post by Pete & Tim on Jul 16, 2007 12:47:41 GMT -5
You know it Jim.
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Post by Pete & Tim on Jul 16, 2007 13:03:41 GMT -5
Now let's look at this, shall we? Genesis 1:26-28
26 Then God said, "Let us make man in our image, in our likeness, and let them rule over the fish of the sea and the birds of the air, over the livestock, over all the earth, and over all the creatures that move along the ground."
27 So God created man in his own image, in the image of God he created him; male and female he created them.
28 God blessed them and said to them, "Be fruitful and increase in number; fill the earth and subdue it. Rule over the fish of the sea and the birds of the air and over every living creature that moves on the ground."Now here it clearly states that God's intention for us was to "Be fruitful and increase in number. Now that would lead all of us to believe that God made man and woman to fit together like pieces of a puzzle to form what we know as planet Earth. Fine, but my question is this, if we are created in his own image than how is Ryan Thames a Christian? Ryan Thames clearly can not be what God had in mind for humans and if so then God must be a left handed midget armwrestler who likes putting ropes in oak trees to get rid of things that he dislikes or can not co exist with. Where are all the religious folks now? I need answers!!!! I need an explanation as to why Ryan Thames is supposedly created in the image of God and is a left handed midget homophobic ignorant bigot armwrestler.
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Post by Jim Wagner on Jul 16, 2007 13:09:04 GMT -5
<<< IM LEFT HANDED AND FIND HIM AN ATTRACTIVE MAN, HUBA HUBA
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Post by Pete & Tim on Jul 16, 2007 13:24:47 GMT -5
<------ BIG GAY JIM!!!!
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