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Post by enginterzi on Apr 10, 2007 8:33:58 GMT -5
For those of you that don't know, Ali was and still is the only fighter who could knock out a man while moving back. You experts say he danced around. The man could punch while moving in ALL directions. Mark, i think this is what you mean.Cleveland "Big Cat" Williams who broke Sonny Liston's nose was not in his best shape but the difference was too much between these two great boxers.Liston often said Williams was the hardest puncher he ever fought. pay extra attention at ( 5.26 ) first knock down;
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Post by Mark Evans on Apr 10, 2007 10:13:57 GMT -5
Engin, That is exactly what I am talking about. Great footage. No other boxer in the history of the sport could pull that off. Casey, my memory of Elvis was based on pictures an old child hood friend of mine had. His dad had pictures of him and Elvis together. As his dad was my dads age I assumed it was during Korea as my dad served in Korea. I believe you and stand corrected. And to reiterate I wasn't bashing the King. Did you read my earlier post regarding Tyson? He cut his career short when he fired Rooney after Cuss died. His beating up a very old Holmes hardly qualifies as a big win. I watched Holyfield and Mercer last night. What a great fight! Talk about a slug fest!!!
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Post by Casey Szparaga on Apr 10, 2007 10:38:44 GMT -5
That was a good fight. As great as Holyfield was, I do think he got lucky a few times, Mercer included.
I though he was very lucky to get by Bert Cooper, and Michael Dokes. I also think he fought Holmes, Foreman and Tyson at the right time. He was fun to watch!
We have the same thoughts about Tyson/D'Amato/Rooney. That bum that lost to Douglas was not the real Tyson and I don't think he ever got his willpower, defense, or combinations back.
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Post by Bill Maenza on Apr 10, 2007 11:42:36 GMT -5
We have the same thoughts about Tyson/D'Amato/Rooney. That bum that lost to Douglas was not the real Tyson and I don't think he ever got his willpower, defense, or combinations back. Losing the trainers/mentors was a big blow to Tyson. As for getting his willpower back, I think that Tyson was exposed as a bully type - The type of guy who will back down or crumble when faced with adversity. Could have been special...
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Post by Johnny Edwards on Apr 10, 2007 14:21:10 GMT -5
I watched the talk show where Ali an Tyson were both on it talking to each other an when Ali was asked who would win Ali pointed to Tyson. They asked why and he said well I could dance reall good but if a couple of his hits landed I would be.... (he then laid back like he was knocked out). If not in those exact words it was something to that extent. Also we got to remember Tyson could knock you out with either arm. an a 6-7 punch combination is really hard to stop when the hitter is so powerful and quick. At his Prime I just believe Tyson to be unstoppable unless someone could hit as hard and was as fast as him. He was also short so a lot of the guys had to punch downwards at him. He kinda reminds me of a pitbull.
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Post by Johnny Edwards on Apr 10, 2007 14:22:59 GMT -5
As far as outside of the ring I didn't like Tyson as a person because he quit listening to his trainers and started wanting to party and not workout and just live off of his hype alone. If it wasn't for that an he woulda been more humble I believe he would have established himself as the greatest but he was just a person with bad morals outside of the ring.
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Post by enginterzi on Apr 10, 2007 14:27:20 GMT -5
Johnny,did you also hear what Tyson and Sugar Ray said about this matter? and what happenned at the end of the program when all the joking around ended?
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Post by enginterzi on Apr 10, 2007 14:51:18 GMT -5
was that something like "I AM SHOCKED TO BE HERE WITH SUGAR RAY AND *THE GREATEST*"? and "I KNOW I AM GREAT BUT EVERY HEAD MUST BOW AND EVERY TONGUE MUST CONFESS THAT THIS IS THE GREATEST ONE(by pointing Ali)"?
and standing up n clapping so hard after the showman said,"ALI,YOU ARE TRULY GREATEST OF ALL TIME"?
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Post by Johnny Edwards on Apr 10, 2007 15:00:52 GMT -5
That was out of mutual respect for each other. They both said a good word about each other. Yes I did watch the end of the program. But had they really fought I believe Tyson would have won and some believe Ali would have won. None of us will really ever know because it's never going to happen so we can just ponder and make theories about what "would" have happened cause no one truly knows.
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Post by Russell Stark on Apr 12, 2007 11:12:16 GMT -5
That was out of mutual respect for each other. They both said a good word about each other. Yes I did watch the end of the program. But had they really fought I believe Tyson would have won and some believe Ali would have won. None of us will really ever know because it's never going to happen so we can just ponder and make theories about what "would" have happened cause no one truly knows. That is one we would all love to see! But I think that Tyson has a weak mind and Ali would have got into it.
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Post by Casey Szparaga on Apr 12, 2007 13:30:12 GMT -5
Original Topic... Can Holyfield win a title? At first I didn't think so, but after he beat Oquendo, I think he could perhaps beat in order: Briggs, Maskaev, or Valuev, all three by work rate, and volume of punches. Not Klitchko unless he has another meltdown.
Definitely not Peter, Toney.
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